Scary Situation Brewing in the Middle East...

Time to let it go, Squid. Take a deep breath, let it out slowly and let go of this issue. You're going to get dizzy going around in circles with this.

 

Oh, that's right, I'm talking to MR DRAMA! :lol:

 

Given your hypothetical situation … no, I would *not* order an attack inflicting massive collateral damage, and I would take the chance Winnipeg would end up a crater as a result.

Why, you ask?

Because I have to live with myself, and the only way I can sleep at night is to “do the right thing.â€

Just like at work, I can be as shrewd and cold-hearted as the next fellow. But I stop short of whipping out a shiv and backstabbing co-workers just for the thrill of it. Oddly enough, I’m respected for that.

I’ve traveled enough to foreign countries to understand – at a level you cannot possibly comprehend – that the world is a very complicated place, made all the more complicated by many different cultures, ethnicities, and races, which defy the outrageously simple Black And White world you’ve created in your evil little mind.

Also, I would not order such a hypothetical attack, due to the very real danger of Escalation. So what if a country claims to be the most powerful nation on earth? A 10 trillion dollar defense platform is useless against determined individuals who don’t align to any particular nation state, particularly if they have access to potent bioweapons.

This reminds me of the history of the Red Scare. You claim to read books, follow along:

In the 1950’s, America was convinced the Red Menace had nuclear weapons superiority, both in absolute numbers and in sophistication. This was the so-called “missile gap.†True enough, the USSR had better rockets, and were first to orbit a crude satellite. At the time it stood to “reason†they could be cranking out thousands of primitive ICBM’s.

The fellow who invented the Polaroid Land Camera, Dr. Edwin Land, also became involved in a secretive program known as Corona, the first launch in 1960. Itek was involved with most of the secret manufacture. It was the first spy satellite, and Dr. Land’s team figured out how to have a capsule return to earth to have the film processed.

They expected the Corona satellite would show massive ICBM development, and “prove†the Missile Gap. Unfortunately, it “proved†just the opposite, that the USSR had the “missile gap†not the United States.

That information was kept Classified until 1996.

So I find it very ironic you subscribe to the “ends and means†viewpoint of the world, as it is a shortened quote from one of the Bolshevik influential thinkers, Leon Trotsky. Let’s review that quote:

“The end may justify the means as long as there is something that justifies the end.â€

Trotsky subscribed to the idea of a permanent state of revolution or upheaval. In true Orwellian fashion, he had to create nebulous “enemies†and to also spy on their own citizens. This is exactly what Lenin and Stalin wanted, a state of perpetual fear.

What has put me off most about Bush – a person I initially supported until he went way off into left field – is the creation of the nebulous “enemy†(Terrorists) and the constantly changing “mission.â€

 

Maggie

Maybe he imagines you as "E" from the Pixar movie The Incredibles?

 

Right before the war began I was having dinner with three Republicans. As the conversation veered towards the pending actions in Iraq one person asked us how we feel about the situation.

I, the only Democrat, said that I had to trust that Bush wouldn’t commit us to a war without some overwhelming evidence. My dining partners all said that I was naïve. One guy, a former pilot in the first Gulf War, said that the GOP had wanted to start a war in that region for a very long time. He suggested I look in to work done by Paul Wolfowitz. I took him up on his suggestion and was shocked (and awed) by what I read.

There are many high-level GOP’ers that disagree with Bush on his handling of the war; two examples are Colin Powell and Tommy Frank (in his book, General Frank explained that he retired because he knew it would end up as a boondoggle… not his words)

I offer no suggestions to the problem as I am not qualified to do so. However, as Dr. Evan said, it’s my DUTY to question the happenings of our military and government. It seems to me, and many Americans (except the ones that get their news from FOX), that GWB has made a mess of this war.

I’ve always felt that our president should be above the rabid “bashing†from, well, all Americans. Disagree, but don’t call him an idiot! Scores of people who now are criticisning people for bashing GWB are the same ones that bashed Clinton. Now that the shoe is on the other foot it’s disrespectful to bash GWB like he so rightly deserves for his poor planning and aversion to opposing views on important subjects.

 

You don't either. I'm not saying it degrades into you making grunting noises, but I have a hard time picturing you in a suit working at an office, with a responsible position.

 

Well, I guess my 4 years in the Utah National Guard doesn't count then? In your world, I'd just be a "dumb grunt" anyway.

Know what, you don't strike me as the sort of person who responds to orders.

 

Y'want this armchair-general's take on it? Any race of beings
that is *capable* of going to war for any supposed "reason" has no
right to occupy space on this planet. Period. But here we are.
.
_H*

 

Actually, most Canadians have already gotten over that. They just considered it to be a terrible and dumb mistake caused by some strange policy of the USAF that requires their pilots to fly stoned out of their minds.

Oddly enough, Canadian soldiers are still in Afghanistan, getting shot and killed too. They seem to understand commitment, despite mediocre equipment.

The huge issue I have with collateral involvement is that you create the problem you claim to be “solving.†I posted that gory picture of the little boy with his left arm blow off for a very good reason:

That picture, and plenty others just like it (Limbs missing, gaping chest wounds, gaping head wounds, etc) get a *lot* of press in the Arabic world.

Folks who would probably have stayed on the sidelines see pictures of their own getting maimed, and they get all fired up. Some probably march to their local Terrorist Recruitment Office to sign up.

I know some Utahans who have already returned from their rotations, and they are genuinely horrified at what they witnessed. Those are the ones with real souls though. The ones who laugh about it must be truly evil.

 

Has no right to occupy space? So other animals and organizms that occupy the planet never fight? Man has been warring since the beginning and will be until the end. The challenge is to keep the wars to a manageable state and keep WMD's out of the crazy peoples hands.

 

True enough, but those other critters don't have the ability to destroy themselves and everything else with them.

 

The first part is fine... that's called "peace" in other words.

The second part is highly subjective. It's very easy to label people as crazy, isn't it?

 

I would rather label too many people as crazy than not enough. All it takes is one mistake and the world will change infinitely, and certainly not for the better.

 

Eh... but then you have to be careful and look at yourself in the mirror... how far is too far? At what point do you become the crazy one?

Moreover, what you said reminds me of something very interesting, and completely opposite to what you just said about "crazy ones."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Think_Different

So yeah... i disagree with your assesment that anyone you label crazy can only do harm. Some may see insanity, some may see genius.