Seat Lock Starts Fight on Flight!

We already have. During the cold war it was considered necessary to research all useful and useless propulsion technologies that could be tried out. There is a special fascination with exotic ideas that have neither military or commercial value. One was trying to punch a really fast hole in water while totally blind, using immense energy inefficiently, and spending a huge sum of $$$ to show it was not worth pursuing.

 

China does already have plans in place, not for this but for a high-speed (250-300mph) rail link from Beijing to LA, through Alaska. It could do it today, using existing technology, and the journey would only take a little over 24 hours. But they're never going to get permission from the US.

It's a shame, because it would be great. You could have sleeper carriages, so it'd be comfortable. And it could be powered using nuclear or renewable power, so it'd reduce emissions too. And it would be great for trade. But I can't see the Americans letting it happen.

 

I'm very sorry. If I'd known it was you sitting next to me, I'd have said hello.

 

I did, I must say, have an utterly joyous flight on Saturday on which none of those rights were infringed.

It was on Air Asia, which is a Malaysian budget airline. I flew Sydney to Kuala Lumpur (7-8 hours) and then Kuala Lumpur to Shanghai (5 hours).

They have this deal with a company called OptionTown where you can pay for the chance to get some sort of upgrade. If you get it, they keep the money, and if you don't, you get most of your money back, except for a $1-2 admin fee. I got the upgrade I applied for on each leg.

From Sydney-KL, I paid an extra US$ 25 or so, and got a whole row of three seats (by the window) to myself. That meant I didn't have to listen to the life story in violation 4, or smell the air of violation 5 (although I think an old man a couple of rows in front of me may have followed through at one point, but he then went off to the toilet, and came back smelling of soap). I had three trays, so no problem with violation 1, and my choice of four armrests, so no problem with violation 2. Also, my row was in the front section of seven rows which was a child-free zone, so violation 3 didn't happen either.

From KL-Shanghai, I paid an extra US$ 50 or so, and got upgraded to Business. So there was a nice built-in tray (no violation 1), big wide armrests (no violation 2), a no-child policy (no violation 3), and I was in the front row, so I got fresh air before it was violated by any fartblossoms other than the drivers (so no violation 5). Also, I pretended I couldn't speak Chinese, which allowed me to avoid violation 4 from the old lady next to me.

It was my nicest flight in ages.

 

Back when I used to fly there was a VERY easy way to keep your fellow inmates from bothering you....

.....open up a bible.

 

In the olden days in Britain, when I were a lad, trains had four seats around a table. If you could get four seats to yourself for the journey, it was heaven.

Putting your bags on the seats around you wouldn't work: people would just ask you to move them.

Trying to look grumpy or threatening made no difference at all.

But smiling at everyone as they walked down the aisle - perhaps even patting the seat next to you encouragingly - absolutely guaranteed that you'd get the four seats to yourself.

 

iirc, on japan airlines, they had to discontinue that because everyone sat on the left and the plane wouldn't fly straight.

 

Indeed

Note that the person behind also paid for that shared space.

Space that he needs to enter and exit the seat, to access his carry-on bag stowed in his assigned footspace beneath the seat in front, and to make use of the tray table for meals and laptops.

Space that he occupied first, during loading and taxiing and takeoff and climbout when safety regulations prohibit you from using that space. Space that is mechanically locked out from the recliner in numerous seats on the vessel, without specific notice from the airline during seat assignment. (You can find out from Seatguru, but often not from the airline itself.)

If you cannot make reasonable accommodation to equitably share this shared space, then you are the one who needs to buy a higher class of ticket in a roomier section.

I can cover the great bulk of my needs with a 50-50 split of the shared space. But after getting hit hard on the head by a recliner that slammed all the way back without notice, and without apology, I've become more militant with my claim to a portion of this space.

 

I just fundamentally disagree. The recline is an included function of the seat that I have paid for. I don't see this as shared space as more than likely, your seat reclines as well. I am more than courteous to all of my fellow passengers, as I fly a whole lot, but in thousands of flights, I've had just one person who protested rudely by constantly banging the seat back, despite my need for sleep after having worked for more than 24 hours straight. In general, nearly everyone reclines as soon as they are allowed. It does not, despite the protesting of so many here and in the NYTimes article comments, prevent you from using your tray table, accessing your belongings, or entering and exiting the rows. I have never once been asked by someone to put my seat up so they could use the tray table, and use mine all the time with the seat in front reclined.

Will I make a concession in the case of someone who is extremely tall, disabled, etc? Absolutely, especially if they are polite. Just like I take great pains not to disturb those sleeping next to me if I'm on the inside, don't hog the armrests, etc.

 

Where is this written down or actually decided? Do the folk that get non-reclining seats in front of an exit row or in front of a bulkhead get rebates or discounts. That answer is no, they do not. Why not?

I'm not discounting your opinion or rationale. That is not my point here. But I am questioning what justification you have actually bought something using ANY justification other than you feel like you have paid for it.

 

If it were not part of what I'd paid for, the airline would not have included it. I have paid for a seat for a given a period of time. If it includes recline, I expect to be able to use it. If it includes a tray, I expect to be able to use it, same with a tv, underseat storage, etc.

Yes, some seats are better than others on planes, but for the most part, the better seats go to people who have paid more. The only time I end up in the rear seats that don't recline, or other especially bad seats is when I've had to make a last minute change and I'm 'paying' for it by feeling lucky to have a seat at all.

 

After looking at the Knee defender devices, they eventually should be outlawed...purely on passenger safety reasons. While it prevents reclining, it also locks down the tray trapping one or two passengers. When the first key breaks off in the device preventing granny from getting out then someone will wakeup to the safety issue.

 

Both passengers were at fault. The one using a device not allowed who refused removal and the one who assaulted that person with the water while the Flight Crew was trying to manage the situation. This whole thing was about perceived entitlement, ego and rude behavior which disrupted the lives and plans of the other passengers. For the record, those seats do not recline very far at all and do not disrupt the use of the tray table or the activities of the person behind them.

 

Whenever I buy a ticket, it warns me if a seat has limited or no incline (and then I choose a different seat).

It is reasonable to expect a person to Warn you before they recline their seat, but not reasonable to prevent them from using full recline. I've sat near people flying from Australia or Europe, and they needed to sleep. It is unreasonable for me to demand they be sleep-deprived (a form of torture under the Geneva convention). That would make me an arse,

 

BTW I used to work for the U.S. Government (FAA). Any device that blocks passengers from egress during an emergency landing is already defined as Illegal under the federal code. The airlines know this, but they have not trained their staff well enough.