Smoke and Mirrors

You mean the same Ford Focus that's rated at 26/35? That's hardly INefficient?

 

I think he was being sarcastic. The Ford is efficient, but the Lexus is not...

 

malorn,

219 posts in six days? Don't you have a car dealership to manage?

 

Well well well.

This is all starting to make a lot more sense. For the benefit of the doubt, I'll assume you're really a Chevy dealer and not a 17 year old troll as another nice forum member had convinced me.

Though I must report that when I left the office this afternoon, the popular money was split about 2/3 Chevy dealer and 1/3 17 year old who lives in his parents basement and doesn't have a job but mooches off them. Looks like I lost.

As far as trying to gauge the "passion" of Toyota, let me assure you that I at least am NOT passionate about ANY company. They all set out to accomplish the same thing - make wads of money - unless they're registered as a Charity.

Even Charities have been known to rake in wads of money for their own benefit.

Maybe you should be trying to gauge why The General appears to be so out of touch with the car buying public. Why the twin bastard children Tough Pickup and SUV were a marketing ploy that worked beyond any wild expectation.

Especially SUV's were able to exploit the fears and inferiorities of a lot of potential car buyers, along with being the next bling-bling fashion statement. Consider that even tried-and-true performance and luxury car companies – Mercedes, BMW, and Porsche – had to make their own version of the SUV to be competitive.

SUV’s especially are the quintessential North American statement of Bigger Is Better arrogance that embodies our selfish and ignorant lifestyle. As one poster had to state, we shouldn’t be ashamed of our “success.†Let’s face it our “success†has peaked and this is now decadence.

That probably wouldn’t matter if we had more oil than we knew what to do with, and it was cheaper than air. Last time I checked, the U.S. only has enough useable domestic energy reserves to meet 50% of current demand. The rest must be imported from unstable and dangerous countries with horrid record in human rights.

Of course, we can toot our own horn when it comes to “human rights†but it’s ok to look the other way when convenient. That is, as long as cheap oil keeps gushing out, who cares what happens to people “over there?â€

Canada is in the odd situation of having MORE energy than it needs, but at very high prices. So although you find SUV’s and pickups here too, there are a lot more cars on average - per capita basis - than in the U.S.

As far as my experience with cars, let’s look at my 25 year driving history. My Dad bought new a 1980 Toyota 4x4 for his small construction company as his personal “puddle jumper.†Thing is, it was very reliable and easy to care for. Even when I learned to drive on it and get my license.

I worked hard as a helper at his construction company and was able to get my first vehicle new, a 1984 Ford F-150 4x4. It was also fairly reliable and simple to care for, I still have it. Maybe nostalgia is involved. I also got a short-term ’85 Omni that was ok for fuel economy but a very poor quality car.

In 1990 I bought a new 4Runner. Right from the start I had trouble with the 5spd transmission. The dealer was VERY apologetic and really bent over backwards to keep me satisfied, at 5,000km he finally had a new transmission under warranty. The key was how they went out of their way to keep my satisfied.

In 1992 I bought a Honda Prelude, a fun little car. In 1994 the left rear hub started making noises, so the dealer replaced the hub under warranty. The Honda dealer also went out of his way to keep me satisfied.

With both the 4Runner and the Prelude the only time the dealer saw me was for alignments and timing belts. So that wasn’t very often. By 2000, I felt that both vehicles, though still in great shape, had the years and km’s against them. The 4Runner in particular I used to drive a lot between Ontario and Utah, as we were in the process of moving back to Canada during that time. It had over 320,000km when I decided to sell both vehicles.

I was able to quickly find buyers for the Prelude and 4Runner, then given my needs at the time decided to order a new pickup to tow a 7,200 lb camper I had. I special ordered a Sunset Gold 2000 GMC Sierra SLT 4x4: sportside box, Z71, Z82 towing, 4.10 gears, locking rear.

The problems started about two weeks after I got the truck. I backed out of the garage and noticed a huge puddle of gear oil on the garage floor: rear pinion seal was bad. And although I’m positive it was a coincidence, when I started again I released the parking brake and it went CLANG the spring inside the pedal assembly broke.

The dealer was a bit testy about having to replace the pinion seal, and claimed the parking brake pedal assembly was backordered. That took two months to show up, so I always had to reach down to pull up the pedal.

The infamous Vortec knock-knock started at 5,000km, along with a bit of oil burning. Then the trouble with the drum-in-hat parking brakes always needing adjustments, then the mode select cluster switch trouble, etc etc. In every instance, the service manager and especially the dealership owner were complete s***s.

How dare I complain about a GMC truck! I’m too picky! Yeah right.

Is my Prius perfect? No, but then again I’m supposed to be “picky.†Quite frankly, the bucket seats in my Sierra SLT were way more comfy, though the Prius has a bit better legroom. The Prius has too harsh of a ride, especially on washboardy gravel roads and over city potholes.

My Prius was even one of those rare Prius cars that conked out due to the software glitch. That happened last year and it was the first vehicle that ever quit on me. Naturally I was tweeked over it.

My Toyota dealer really went out of his way to keep me happy, or at least calm me down. It happened on a Friday and they right away arranged for a free loaner car, which turned out to be a Ford Focus from the local Enterprise.

I took one look at that thing and said “No way I’m going to drive that POS. Forget about it, not after paying that kind of money for a Prius that quit on me.â€

So what happened? The dealership owner, already biting his nails over my Prius quitting on me, gave me the keys to HIS demonstrator Avalon XLS and HE took the Focus home! Would YOU do that for a customer?

So I had a chance to drive around the weekend in a fully loaded Avalon XLS. It was ok, but the city fuel economy was about ½ the Prius. They had my Prius reprogrammed first thing Monday morning and drove it out to the office to swap it with the Avalon. The dealership owner himself drove my Prius.

Maybe my dealership is an exception, but from what I hear, every Toyota dealer in Winnipeg will do similar things to keep their customers happy.

In case you were wondering, if my previous posts didn’t hint at it, not only am I a very literal Conservative, but I’m also a VERY disgruntled ex-GMC Sierra SLT 4x4 truck owner.

Perhaps if the GMC Truck dealer hadn’t acted like such a s*** when my truck had all those problems, I might have been a lot more ambivalent towards The General. I quite frankly could care less if Lutz sprinted naked as a jaybird down 5th Avenue at noon, it’s the dealer that will make and break a company.

In your case, a lot of bad dealers with a “blame the customer first†mentality have done more for destroying The General’s reputation than any Prius forum ever did.

 

Again I think you have repeatedly answered your own question(s): Corporate management really humped the bunk on this one.

For my driving the EV1 would have been the perfect car, but GM saw fit to destroy every single one. Why is that? Too embarrassing to have a “responsible†car next to an H2? Might confuse the Sheeple?

When I first saw my Prius – the one I’m driving now – it was parked inside the showroom. The dealer is also a Lexus dealership, and it was sandwiched between a fully loaded black LS430 and a Tundra.

At least that dealership has no problem showcasing the best of what they can offer.

 

WHY is this thread at 32 pages and still going. I'm thinking this horse has been beaten to death.

 

You know, part of the problem you have trying to get your point across is the reference to “war†and “guns.†As a Dual Citizen I know a lot of Americans – including those returned from the Gulf – who are increasingly worried about how America is portrayed in the rest of the world.

The Cowboy Diplomacy has fallen flat on its face and has to go. At first I was bemused by it, now I cringe whenever I hear it. We’re making too many enemies, and they’re starting to get increasingly radical in the process.

Know what, I’m your typical stocky white guy with a receding hairline. But I have enough career experience and life experience to know that I’d be the biggest disappointment to my folks, and a real numb bastard to boot, if I thought I personally or my race in general were somehow “superior.â€

As part of my ever-increasing job duties for the past 8 years, not only have I had to travel to countries like China, South Korea, and India, but have also had to screen summer interns and prospective new hires.

I think MysterySquid said something about our “work ethic.†Not sure what you mean by that, but I have seen a huge erosion in our work ethic over the past 15-20 years to the point every college graduate has a chip on their shoulder and an entitlement philosophy.

OTOH the business travel I have been BLESSED with has really opened my eyes. Say what you want about folks in India, China, South Korea, or whatever, they really DO have work ethic. And they constantly prove it too. Even more shocking, at least around Yours Truly, they are painfully polite.

Counting myself we have a staff of 20 “professional†employees with various job titles, some perm most contract: Chemical engineer, mechanical engineer, civil engineer, electrical engineer, systems analyst, etc. All of the engineers have or are in process to get PE certified (Professional Engineer approval).

Of the 20, the 9 out of 10 most recent new hires are all Asian: Seven are Chinese, one is Japanese, and one is from South Korea. The sole exception among the new hires is a graduate Mechanical Engineer from the University of Manitoba, the guy with the VW Golf tdi.

All the Asians have extremely driven work ethic, which they claim is a way of life “back home.†All are making top dollar in a good field, and all are very nice, polite, and willing to ask questions if they do happen to get stuck at something.

I admit my experience over the past 8 years has probably clouded my judgment of Asians versus “us.†I have found almost without exception all the white college grads to be a bunch of whiny Generation X spoiled degenerate crybabies who run to Mommy the instant I expect any real work from them. The exception is the guy with the VW Golf, he’s a hard worker and nice to be around.

I don’t think I take any particular pleasure in firing people, nor do I take pleasure in saying “no†to a person, but after awhile dealing with the summer interns it got to the point where I would simply give them a comment that rhymes with “duck shoe†and show them the door.

You appear to fear this “Asian invasion†whatever that is. I welcome it, at least they’re not spoiled degenerate crybabies. Had better brush up on Cantonese, Hokkien, and Modern Standard Chinese though.

 

Ok. i'm starting to lose where this is going. I think about a page ago was a good place to stop.

 

Good idea stick a fork in this, it's done already.

I think I've solved enough serious world problems for one night.

 

I'm starting to get board with PriusChat just because this is the only thread people are posting to. And I didn't just bump it up myself it was already at the top of the latest topics. Yawn!

 

I agree. I know this will get lost in the THOUSANDS of replies on this topic, but the chat board of one of the most reliable, most fuel-efficient vehicles on the planet is not a forum for debating the CAFE ratings of GM vs Toyota!

PLEASE HAVE THE BALLS TO GO TO THE CHAT BOARDS OF HUMMERS (which aren't even CAFE rated!!!)

This thread is WAY beyond annoying. :angry:

I think most of what needed to be said was on page 1.

I'm also getting annoyed with the sink this has on actual Prius posts.

I'm sorry, but this is still a Troll situation. It has no place on the chat board of one of the least offending vehicles on the planet!

 

Did I miss something?

:lol:

 

No not really... Engineers can have much less ego.

 

No, all the engineers I know are rather laid back...

I think the sight of all those gen xer's hanging around playing video games and reading comics well into their 30's has finally gotten to him (of which I proudly state I am part of!)...

Hmm, then again he was wasting a lot of time at his workplace due to this thread, and managed to suck other employees into it... That's HIGHLY unethical, and unproductive behavior... :lol:

 

It has been a slow week and we were bored. But the posts were very entertaining, especially YOURS

 

btw, could I please borrow $100 for a credit card bill I accidentally ran up? I didn't realize the latest Warcraft would send me over my limit...
:wub:

 

OK, I didn't read every single post on this thread but I wanted to give my $.02 to Malaise... er... Malorn.

* You said something earlier about wanting us all to consider a truck. I don't have any desire to own a truck, it doesn't fit my needs.

* I have a 92 Camry with 247k+ miles, runs fine and my next car will be a Prius.

* I don't think that Toyota is only interested in hybrid technology and they won't stop just there.

* Not sure what your problem is. Maybe you need to tell everybody (not just here on Priuschat) but the whole nation to stop buying anything foreign and just boycott the rest of the world. Maybe that would make you happy once again.