Solid-state battery powered Prius by 2025?

Discussion in 'Prime Technical Discussion' started by SR-71, Jan 22, 2022.

  1. SR-71

    SR-71 Member

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  2. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    This was already posted. Look at the news forum. No, there won't be a solid-sate battery on any Prius anytime soon.
     
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  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i think prime nearly hits the sweet spot of mpg/price/range. unlikely to see major changes. if anything, probably more decontenting to keep price down
     
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  4. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    The next Prius Prime redesign in 2024 (2025 model year) will probably have a 40-mile range (a 60% increase) definitely on a non-solid-state battery.
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    has that been stated by toyota? i don't see how it would even be possible
     
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  6. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    At one point, I think Toyota mentioned that the next Prius Prime would be a separate design than the Prius, with the battery located not in the luggage compartment. Also, the battery energy density has increased quite a bit since 2017.
     
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  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    that would be wonderful. i would definitely be interested
     
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  8. eliteconcept

    eliteconcept 700 mile club, top tank mpg 69.5

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    I believe the next gen prius will be built on the same platform as the bz4x... they said many cars will come out based on that platform
     
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  9. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    @Salamander_King, how much did you estimate to gain/lose when you switch from the Prius Prime to the Subaru Soltera/bZ4X later this year?
     
  10. Rmay635703

    Rmay635703 Senior Member

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    There may not even be a car labeled Prius in a few years, the hybrid version is already discontinued in Europe, hopefully recent gas surges renew interest by both buyers and Toyota, I for one DO NOT want a RAV4, Prius Prime would be best if I replace an antique.
     
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  11. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Gain/Lose what? I will be gaining about 200 miles of EV range. I will be losing some EV efficiency but EPA numbers are not out yet, so I don't know for sure. But if I use the Rav4 Prime EPA value of 94 mpge, I will be losing 39 mpge from PP's 133 mpge.
     
  12. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    $$$$
     
  13. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Oh, I see. Then I have no idea. The price of the Subaru Soltera has not been announced yet. There is no Gain or Loss on a car until I sell it. So, even after I know the price, I would not know what the gain/loss will be a year or two later if I decide to switch a car again.
     
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  14. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    They say it will be around $45k. So, you will lose about $11k at the time of the trade-in after considering the $7.5k tax credit. I can't afford it. Besides, my tax credit saturates around $4.5k and I would have to install a Level 2 charging station, bringing the extra cost over the Prius Prime to around $20k.

    You will find out how buying a new car drains your bank account. LOL Prius Prime was an exceptionally affordable car.
     
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  15. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    I never consider gain/loss in trade-in. I have to consider capital assets one at a time at the time of selling just like stock or crypto, otherwise, you never know what your capital gain/loss on the asset is.

    That being said, If I sell my current PP at $32K, then my capital gain on that car is ~$6K. If I buy a new Soltera at $45K and get $2K rebate from the state, and a $7.5K tax credit from the fed, then my cost base will be ~$35.5K + tax and fees. If I can sell the car for more than that in a year or two later, then I will have a capital gain to report. If it sells less than that, then it will be a loss (but for the tax purpose I don't think I can report it as a capital loss... unlike investment.)

    I am in the same boat as you are. I usually do not have tax liability large enough to claim more than $4500. But for this year, in preparation for the purchase of a BEV or PHEV with a full $7500 tax credit, I changed my retirement investment contribution from pre-tax (tax-deferred) to Roth after-tax. I will have to do the fine-tuning as it gets close to the end of the year, but I should be able to make my tax liability just enough to get the full $7500 credit. The good thing is that whatever I contribute to Roth, I will be able to take out tax-free on both growth and principal after I retire.

    Still, I may or may not go through the purchase of a BEV (or PHEV) this year. Yeah, $45K for a daily driver is way too much. I know that. Even after incentives and tax credit, I would be paying almost $10K more than what I paid for my current PP Ltd. My budget on a car purchase has been always around $20K. I don't like to spend any more than that on a car. I was able to afford a PP with an MSRP of $29-35K simply because of the cashback, discount, incentives, tax credit, and the capital gain at the end. But, I don't expect a capital return on future cars I purchase, which is true even for another PP if I sell my 21 PP Ltd and switch with a 22 PP. Without the large cashback Toyota has been offering, the PP is just like any other car. And after Toyota runs out of tax credit, I think it will be way too expensive to buy just like Tesla is for me now. So, I am sure if I decide to switch the car this year, it will result in a capital loss for sure no matter what car I buy.
     
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  16. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    Moreover, don't forget the sales tax.
     
  17. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    I don't itemize my tax return like you do... at least for the last 4 years of my returns, it did not make my tax situation any better than using the standard deduction. So, the sales tax just goes into the cost basis of the car purchase.
     
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  18. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    I meant it is not $45k but $45k + $3k = $48k. For me, it is almost $50k with the sales tax.
     
  19. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Oh, yes. But without knowing what the price is, I don't even know what the final taxable price tag will be. At least for my state, if I can work out a deal with the dealer to trade in my PP, the amount of the trade-in value would be subtracted from the sales tax calculation. That is why I am seriously considering trading in my 2021 PP Ltd for a 2022 Leaf SV with technology pkg (MSRP $32450 including destination charge). I can get a brand new $32K BEV without paying a penny, in fact, the dealer will cut me a check albeit a small amount. Then a year later, I will be able to receive a $7500 check from IRS. Of course, with Leaf, there is no chance I will be able to sell the car a year or two later for a profit. But, if I am going to keep it as a long-term daily driver, I may end up saving more money than keeping the PP (assuming the gas price stays as high as now). Of course, one caveat is that with a BEV, I will not be able to use it for my long-distance trips. This is true even with a longer range BEV for a foreseeable future, so I will end up using our second car more often for that purpose.
     
    #19 Salamander_King, Mar 8, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2022
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  20. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    I see. Here in California, we don't get a refund for the sales tax.
     
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