Standard Prius Prime Charger (G9060-47130) supporting 240V

Discussion in 'Prime Plug-in Charging' started by Carsten Steenberg, Jan 9, 2018.

  1. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    If it was circuit isolated ("double insulated") by law it has the proper symbol and only needs a 2 prong plug.

    [​IMG]

    If it has a ground pin, it is not double insulated, in my experience.
     
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  2. Flaming

    Flaming Member

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    check this out


    Cut the schuko 2 pin plug and replace it with the NEMA type plug you need , all you have to know is the green-yellow wire is the ground and your good to go.
     
  3. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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  4. Flaming

    Flaming Member

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    i 100% agree with you :LOL:, but i guess everyone has his own situation ... this one on ebay don't ship to my location .. but the other one on Aliexpress can be shipped to my location and a bit cheaper even with the shipping fees .. making it a better solution even if the cable needs to be modified.
     
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  5. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Good point. I hadn't noticed your location. Not hard to change a plug. Enjoy. I love L2 charging on my PiP. I'd think it would be better yet on a Prime.
     
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  6. CharlesH

    CharlesH CA HOV Decal #5 on former PiP

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    I don't know about the EVSE on the Prime, but the one that came with the PiP had components in it (capacitors and such) that were explicitly not rated for 240V. This is per the guy who did the 240V upgrade on the PiP EVSE. Now, they may have put higher rated components in the Prime EVSE, or it may be that the particular components in the OP's EVSE, while not rated for 240V, just happen to not fail at 240V (yet). But without some expert insights into what exactly is in the Prime EVSE, it seems to me to be a bit risky. Not to mention that it may be sending an overvoltage on the control lines that could damage the charger in the car. :cautious:
     
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  7. drysider

    drysider Active Member

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    A dual voltage device requires that you move a wire, flip a switch, or something similar. You cannot just plug a 110v unit into a 240 volt outlet and not expect to lose the smoke. The white wire in a 110v circuit is grounded. In a 240v circuit, it is hot and theoretically has some black tape around it to denote this.
     
  8. CraigM

    CraigM Active Member

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    Yes you can. At least for the iPhone / iPad charger. I’ve traveled to the Philippines (220 Volt, 60 Hz country) and Taiwan, the charger plugs right in. The charger states right on it 100-240V, 50/60 Hz.

    I’m not suggesting our Toyota EVSE is dual voltage because I have no idea, and don’t plan to test. :)
     
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  9. Bob Comer

    Bob Comer Active Member

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    A LOT of laptop power supplies are dual voltage without requiring a physical switch or other manual workaround. Just a plug adapter...
     
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  10. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Exactly! I use my phone, iPad, and laptop chargers in Europe and Africa, and only need a plug adapter to make it fit the outlet. No switches or transformers required.
     
  11. Old Bear

    Old Bear Senior Member

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    I can't tell from the photograph what those orange connectors are. If they are standard NEMA 15-5 connectors (like ordinary U.S. 120v household outlets), even with the warning text, they are a VERY BAD IDEA.

    The concept is OK, but these kinds of adapters are meant to be used with connectors which prevent accidental confusion. It's not unusual to have electrical devices which can operate on different voltages in different countries by changing the power cord to one having a different style connector plug. A good example: most desktop computers have power cords which fit into the computer on one end and into the wall outlet on the other. Those cords come in many different configurations, all with the same connector at the computer end and with a specific connector at the wall-outlet plug-in end depending upon country. They work because the computer's internal power supply can be set to (or automatically adjust to) differing input voltages.

    (If you want to see an amazing range of specialized international power cords used by companies which sell their products in different countries, here is one supplier: International Configurations Inc. They have an extensive online catalog to please any gizmo-loving geek.)

    A good example of how this is implemented in a portable EVSE device, is the dual-voltage unit made by EVI:

    dual-voltage-EVSE.jpg

    You'll notice in the picture that the unit comes with two adapters which connect to the device using a specialized "twist-lok" connector to avoid any confusion:

    connectors.jpg

    It is important to note that this particular EVSE has internal electronics which are designed to function with either 120v or 240v. That may or may not be the the case with other EVSE units -- so changing the physical cord end might work OK -- or it might result in a totally fried EVSE (120v unit plugged into 240v) or an EVSE giving an "under voltage" warning and not charging your car (240v unit plugged into 120v).

    Without knowing the design of the EVSE, it's impossible to know whether or not it can function safely as a dual voltage device. It appears that many different manufactures use an internal circuit board made by Clipper Creek:

    clipper-creek-EVSE-circuit-board.jpg

    And the connection to the circuit board's input side (i.e., the cord coming from the wall outlet) is labelled "Line1_In" and "Line2/N_In" which suggests that the board is designed for both U.S. standard 120v (Line1+Neutral) or for 240v in most of the rest of the civilized world (Line1+Line2). However, this does not guarantee that there are not "jumpers" or connections made between circuit board traces to create different design variations so that the board may be configured for different voltage inputs. I just don't know -- and, personally, I would not take the risk of destroying several hundred dollars of hardware as a way of finding out.

    clipper-creek-internal-connection.jpg

    The bottom line: changing plug-in connectors is possible if it is done properly and if the device is designed to accommodate different input voltages. Otherwise it's risky, dangerous, stupid.

    As an engineer friend likes to say: "Just when you design something that's idiot-proof, they come along an design a better idiot."
     
    #31 Old Bear, Jan 11, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
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  12. drysider

    drysider Active Member

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    Low wattage devices are often dual voltage, which is clearly marked on them. They use a smart charger which recognizes what voltage is available. Larger devices can also have solid state changeover, but it is a lot cheaper for the manufacturer to put in a manual switch or a selectable terminal.
     
  13. vvillovv

    vvillovv Active Member

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  14. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    That's true. The people who answered you and contradicted this don't know the difference between a dual-voltage power supply and a "universal" power supply. The former is designed to run on a particular voltage +/- something like 5% but you can choose two discrete voltages for nominal (often done with series/parallel circuitry or dual-winding transformer changes). The later is designed to run over a wide input voltage range of something like 100V-240V and everything in between.
     
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  15. CharlesH

    CharlesH CA HOV Decal #5 on former PiP

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    Agreeing. The power supplies for things like laptops and mobile phones these days typically use "universal" switching power supplies, that are rated for input 100-240 VAC at 50-60 Hz. You just need a plug adapter, since the style of plug varies by country. The power supply automatically adapts to whatever voltage is presented on its input and produces a constant output DC voltage.
     
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  16. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Quite true. Thanks for calling us on our sloppy terminology. Clarity really is important. (y)
     
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  17. vvillovv

    vvillovv Active Member

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    yea BUT
    comparing a i-thing charger to EVSE is just asking for pain no matter how you look at it LOL
     
  18. Vinagre

    Vinagre Junior Member

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    FYI about modifying your charger for prius prime

    It is my understanding based on a company that makes modifications for electric vehicles chargers, the prius prime charger can't be modify to handle 240V. (EVSE Upgrade)
     
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  19. Rmay635703

    Rmay635703 Senior Member

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    Less than you think, maybe my vacuum would have the power they advertise?
     
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  20. Old Bear

    Old Bear Senior Member

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    I really don't know whether or not the "freebie" EVSE which come with the Prime can be modified.

    However, I did learn this: The J1772 standard provides for a number of specific EVSE functions:

    • Power pins not hot until EVSE‐EV negotiation
    • Ground Fault Circuit Interrupt (GFCI)
    • Graceful start‐up/shut‐down
    • Ground verification
    • Pilot signal detection and verification
    • Stuck Relay detection​

    Basically, the J1772 plug connects your car directly to what ever line voltage source is supplied, be it 120v or 240v. It's up to the charger module inside the car to deal with the supplied voltage. The Prime is designed to accept both 120v and 240v.

    But, here's where the magic of the EVSE device becomes important. That little circuit board keeps voltage off of the connector until it knows it is plugged into the car. It does this by using electro-mechanical contactors which provide absolute on/off switching. By means of the "pilot signal", it tells the car what the maximum current the EVSE can deliver. And, it acts a a ground fault circuit interrupter to allow you to safely plug the connector into your car even if you're standing in a puddle of salt water.

    That little circuit board may or may not be able to work with 120v or 240v. And it may include other features like checking the input voltage and reporting 120 volts as being an under-voltage error condition or 240 volts as being an over-voltage error condition. It may also monitor the temperature of the J1772 connector to prevent a melt-down if there is a problem of over-current or a bad connection.

    What's really interesting about the J1772 standard is that it has very little to do with the actual battery-charging device inside the car other than to act as a well-behaved doorman to assure the safety of the user and of the charging device.
     
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