Standard Prius Prime Charger (G9060-47130) supporting 240V

Discussion in 'Prime Plug-in Charging' started by Carsten Steenberg, Jan 9, 2018.

  1. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    I think we have two definitions of 'supporting' here.

    1) the ESVE has not melted.

    2) the ESVE clearly states it is for 110 to 120 volts.

    Most of us are happy with the latter definition. So long as Carsten does not sue or claim insurance when/if the former definition damages property, I am happy for him.
     
  2. Old Bear

    Old Bear Senior Member

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    Actually, it's a cord adapter, obviously, not certified by Underwriters Laboratory... but I don't think it's a building code issue any more than your screwing around with your toaster oven.

    However, you're correct in observing that the adapter provides a way to unwittingly connect a 120-volt device to a 240-volt outlet. You certainly would not want to leave it hanging from the outlet like some kind of electronic Venus-Flytrap luring an unsuspecting user to plug something into it indiscriminately.

    For that reason, it would be wise to cut the NEMA 5-15 120-volt off of the Prime EVSE "charger" and replace it with a twist-lock plug. Then you would make TWO separate adapter cords, both with female twist-lock connectors on one end, and one with a NEMA 5-15 for a standard 120-volt outlet and the other with a NEMA 5-30 or 5-50 to fit the 240-volt outlet which you're using.

    That's the approach taken by Chargers4evs' dual voltage portable charger shown here:

    Dual-Voltage-EVSE.jpg

    Note that this arrangement uses a NEMA 6-20 connector rather than a twist lock. The NEMA is similar to a standard NEMA 5-15 except that one of the blades is turned at 90-degrees so that a standard 15-amp plug cannot be inserted into it mistakenly.

    Even so, you spent about $30,000 on your Prime, so why not spend another $300 to get a basic L2 charger for your garage.
     
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  3. Bill Norton

    Bill Norton Senior Member

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    > FUNNY description of the situation!:)

    >>I would never modify the stock EVSE. If you don't have your collection of hoopty adapters with it on the road, "No Charging for You".
    Plus - WARRANTY.:cool:
    Plus - 2 of those wires go to a temp sensor in the plug. You'd lose that by cutting the original off and maybe kill the unit without it.

    >>> Always my point exactly. Open up that dusty old billfold just a little bit more and get true 3.3kW L2 charging.(y)
     
    #83 Bill Norton, May 24, 2018
    Last edited: May 24, 2018
  4. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Not surprising. Even if the engineers don't want them over engineered, the lawyers do. ;)

    As for the venus fly trap possibility, I would zip tie the adapter to the original cable so that you can only unplug from the wall.
     
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  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i don't see any problems with this adapter.
     
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  6. leaftoprius

    leaftoprius Junior Member

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    burnout8488, Can you share the wiring diagram of the adapter you built?

    I have a dryer socket (NEMA 14-30) in the garage. How can I build an adapter for using the standard Prius Prime EVSE?

    Thanks.
     
  7. CharlesH

    CharlesH CA HOV Decal #5 on former PiP

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    As to countries that don't use 240V, add Japan to the list. They use 100V (not 120V). That country just might be relevant to Toyota.:rolleyes:

    With the European version of the EVSE, the short cord that goes to the wall outlet is detachable. Everyone in Europe may use 240V 50Hz, but there are about half a dozen different plug styles.

    As to whether the US version of the Prime EVSE is designed to work with 240V, all I can do is refer to discussions here about the PiP EVSE, where the guy who did 240V upgrades to the stock PiP EVSE said that there were components in it, such as capacitors, which were not rated for 240V. It may well be that the Prime EVSE used in the US is actually designed for 100-240V, but I will let others sort that out.
     
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    did you miss post #69?
     
  9. CharlesH

    CharlesH CA HOV Decal #5 on former PiP

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    Which only tells us that that particular device handled the 240V without blowing up. Components are always over-rated; if it is rated for N volts, it typically isn't going to fail at N+1 volts, and at exactly what voltage a particular component will fail varies. Others have indicated that the circuit board in the Prime EVSE is a common one that is designed for 240V, but is packaged in a way such that the overall device is rated at only 120V.
     
  10. leaftoprius

    leaftoprius Junior Member

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    Why were there many more discussions on using the stock EVSE for GM Volt than similar discussions for Prius (either PIP or Prius Prime)?

    It looks like the discovery that the stock EVSE was able to run on 240v was also found by users' trial-and-error. No?
     
  11. Roy2001

    Roy2001 Active Member

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    If someone can post the wiring diagram, it would be a easy DIY project.

    I suspect OEM like Clipper Creek only makes L2 chargers only. They don't specifically design an L1 charger. Hope someone can open the charger to confirm. I checked the Prime charger and it is made in Japan. Is there any OEM maker in Japan?

    UPDATE: I found this website: CarCharging.us

    http://carcharging.us/images/NEMA_simplified_pins.pdf

    Not sure if this is how to:

    From a NEMA 14-50
    When converting from a NEMA 14-50 plug on your EVSE, you just wire the ground of the adapted plug to the ground of the 14-50 receptacle, and the two hots of the plug onto the two hots of the 14-50 receptacle. Ignore the neutral.

    If you feed it 120V instead of 240V (to built a TT-30 adapter, for instance), then wire the leftmost blade of the NEMA 14-50 receptacle to the 120V hot, and the rightmost blade to the 120V neutral, assuming you are looking at the face of the NEMA 14-50 receptacle and the ground is on the bottom. Some EVSEs are picky about which pins the 120V/neutral comes in on.

    UPDATE: Electric car charging within electrical code and power outlet limits

    [​IMG]
     
    #91 Roy2001, May 30, 2018
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
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  12. Old Bear

    Old Bear Senior Member

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    The diagram is more or less where you end up, but if you're making an adapter cord, the connector shown on the left above would be a NEMA 5-20R or 5-15R female receptacle to mate with the plug on the end of your Prime's EVSE power cord. The connector on the right would be a NEMA 14-50P male plug to fit into the outlet on your wall.

    (The diagram above is for a 50-amp adapter to allow a 240-volt welding machine or similar device which has a 50-amp 6-50P plug to be connected to a 50-amp 14-50 outlet. It is not for the purpose of connecting a 120-volt plug to a 240-volt outlet.)

    Power-connectors.jpg

    As I have noted previously, the problem with the arrangement which you're proposing is that it allows anyone to come along and plug a 120-volt device (lamp, power tool, toaster, fan, etc.) into a 240-volt power source. Experience has shown that warning labels, zip-ties, or the bodies of previous victims will not deter some people from using this home-made device improperly.

    It is far from idiot proof. And, even if it were, it is said that if you design something that is absolutely idiot proof, someone will come along and design a bigger idiot.
     
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  13. Roy2001

    Roy2001 Active Member

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    I completely agree with you. That's why I would like to DIY an adapter as you proposed, instead of modifying the outlet, to make it a NEMA 5-15 or 5-20 with 240v. The OP already taught us how that could risk the car or appliances.

    BTW, I tried to open the Prime charger but it has the triangle screw drives. So no way I can look inside. Hope someone could open it to verify if it is L2 safe. I assume it is.
     
  14. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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  15. Roy2001

    Roy2001 Active Member

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    Thanks for the link.

    I assume it is 120-240v safe as it does not make economy sense to make a specific 120v version charger, and many devices are 120-240v compatible. Also, volt owners already proved that the OEM charger is 240v compatible and it is safe to use it.

    I am not promoting it based or my assumption but would like to dig out, and OP already learned that it is not disastrous immediately to connect it to 240v. Just hope some of us can find this out just like what volt owners did, to open the charger, and check it carefully.

    I would NOT try to use it as L2 charger and I would suggest others not to do so as well, but hope we can prove it we can.
     
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  16. triggerhappy007

    triggerhappy007 Active Member

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    Here's the Volt adapter video:


    I think I will try to make an adapter to a dryer plug to use when I travel.
     
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  17. Digloo2

    Digloo2 Active Member

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    I thought I'd mention that I finally got around to hooking up all of the electrical parts to adapt my 3-pin 240V dryer plug to work with my EVSE power cord. From some private messages with folks who build these adapters and sell them, I was assured that the "worst case" scenario is that the EVSE block would go into a "fault" mode and just not do anything. These things are mainly just electronic switches with a bunch of sensors added to limit voltage, current, shorts, opens, and other things. I was also assured that even though the box says it's for 120v, the innards are made for dual-voltage needs.

    With that, I went ahead and hooked up my own adapter and plugged the EVSE into it, and ... viola! I saw the normal orange light come on.

    Then I plugged the other end into the car, and it went through the normal connection process and started charging.

    Nothing got hot or even warm.

    The only thing curious about it is that when I open the car door while it's charging, the dashboard always says "1 hr 40 min" as the charge time. It doesn't matter if I only put 5 miles on the traction battery since the last charge or completely drained it. With 120V, it always says "5 hr 20 min" or thereabouts.

    What I can say with confidence is ... it charges WAY FASTER on 240V than 120V!
     
  18. triggerhappy007

    triggerhappy007 Active Member

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    Can you link to what parts you used?

    Can you confirm the wiring from 120V to 240V is hot neutral ground to hot hot ground?
     
  19. leaftoprius

    leaftoprius Junior Member

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    How much charge time would it show if the car is connected to a standard or commercial level 2 EVSE?
     
  20. vvillovv

    vvillovv Active Member

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    remember the gen1 and 2 PIP bricks are different from the prime brick in at least one way
    prime = no test button - test mode
    for example
    may be others inside.
     
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