Suing over Pre-Collision System

I kinda like the MKZ, but It's a little bit more than I want to spend for a car.
One of the groovy things about technology is that even us blue collar work-a-day folk will be driving an entry-level car with PCS before too long.
Cars cost a butt-ton of money as a result, but you can't say that they're not also much safer as well as MUCH more reliable than they were in the days of vinyl seats and big fins.

 

problem with the suit is that it is based on false information - up until 2014 models, no Toyota/Lexus had City Brake feature which is what was tested in test (and only up to 15 mph too, it wont auto brake at higher speeds). Few weeks ago they added it to most of their 2014 Lexus models.

They are confusing radar cruise control that can stop the car with Pre-Collision system that will "only" warn you and prime all the systems for crash - as was noted in all marketing materials. Radar cruise control will work properly when activated but this is not what was tested.

Even cars with city brake system dont work automatically above 25 mph.

 

"When there is a high possibility of a frontal collision, the system warns
the driver using a warning light, warning display and buzzer. If the sys-
tem determines that a collision is unavoidable, the brakes are automat-
ically applied to reduce the collision speed. Pre-collision braking can be
disabled using the pre-collision braking off switch.
...
Pre-collision braking:
• Vehicle speed is greater than about 10 mph (15 km/h).
• The speed at which your vehicle is approaching the obstacle or the
vehicle running ahead of you is greater than about 10 mph (15 km/h).
• The pre-collision braking off switch is not pressed"
From the 2013 Prius manual, http://www.toyota.com/t3Portal/document/om/OM47791U/pdf/sec_02-04.pdf

Only specifies reducing the collision speed. The suite will come down to how well Toyota stressed that.

Here's info on the IIHS test.
What you need to know about the new IIHS crash prevention ratings | Torque News.

Subaru, Cadillac, and Volvo all did well to great on the new IIHS test using camera, radar, or laser based system. So Toyota can't claim the test doesn't work with their sensor choice of radar. But I think its main failing is not meeting NHTSA minimum requirements in alerting the driver of a collision.

 

Nasty
National Class Action Filed For Prius Pre-Collision System - HybridCars.com
Who is suing?

Why are they suing? Its pretty clear to make money, they already got a chunk of that $1.6B and probably know some dirt to get toyota to give them money.

NHTSA fought for years with toyota about unintended acceleration, and when you fight the regulators, and people die, you are going to lose lawsuits. But what government organization that regulates safety is responsable for this?

It wasn't a government organization it was a pac. A pac with quite possibly flawed testing methodology, and a need for publicity. We don't even have a list of any accidents where the system failed, nor an implied warranty that Toyota would pass a test that did not even exist when they sold most of the cars. If it actually does fail to do what it is advertised, and does not meet NHTSA criteria toyota needs to fix the systems, but I doubt that is what this is all about. This is just another frivolous lawsuit that will stifle innovation.

 

You dont really seem to understand what I am trying to say.

IIHS tested new City Brake feature, also called Auto brake. Not available in any Toyota/Lexus prior to 2014.
It is not the same as radar cruise control or PCS. PCS was always advertised as system that will only apply (small amount) of brakes when collision is imminent - not to prevent it. I have read many PR releases for Toyota and Lexus and that was always stressed out.

City Brake function also doesnt work above 25mph in any vehicle, at least not properly, most cars tested will still hit the target if you dont apply brakes yourself.

So as to lawsuit, you could sue any manufacturer from that list as their system does not prevent the crash, even with City brake feature they all operate differently.

It is like suing car manufacturer because they advertised brakes but their car stops in 130ft instead of 125ft which someone determined to be enough to get "top pick" rating.

 

No, I understood. I was actually agreeing with your post, that the pre-collision system is only designed to lessen an impact.

Now, if the IIHS tested a 2014 with City Brake, their results look worse for Toyota.

 

Has distracted driving gotten so bad now that this type of thing is needed? Are drivers today that much worse than the bad old days when the only electronics in a car was a radio?

 

A turkey jumped out in front of my Prius. The pre-collison system worked great, delivering exactly as advertised. Even though I was paying attention, the computer sounding an alarm, flashing a warning, retracting the seatbelts, and braking was quite helpful.

 

All one has to do is drive anywhere....and I mean anywhere in any direction for 20 minutes. The answer to your question will become very apparent.

 

If the historical traffic death figures are any guide, this type of thing could have saved far more lives in the bad old days than it can now.

 

My system is often too quick to warn me of trouble ahead.

Normally, this happens as I approach a stopped or nearly stopped vehicle when approaching going uphill.

My experience lets me judge that my car is going to lose speed as it is also going up hill, and as a result, I will either press on the brake pedal a little bit lighter than normal, or press it a little later than if I was driving on level ground.

Also, I've felt the system apply the brakes quite firmly the odd time, when appropriate I might add, over the years driving it in various traffic situations.

Seems to me that the issues of both this lawsuit and IIHS testing could be resolved with a reflash of the PCS computer.

Of course, things will likely first have to play out in the courts.

Roland.

 

Back then the death rate was much higher.
Car Crash Fatality Statistics | Statistic Brain
Almost 5 times higher in 1960 versus 2010.

Today we have many more potential collisions (more cars per mile of road), more texting, still see women putting on makeup while driving. Eating while driving and drunk driving has gone down and deaths, but why not reduce it even more.

The problem here is the lawyers, not that technology is improving, but doesn't work perfectly.