Taking your DL test with a Prius.. Watch out!

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by m6scott, Nov 16, 2004.

  1. Brian

    Brian Member

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    Back in April, when I turned 16, we already had my Prius. I took that to get my DL. There was NO PROBLEM, probably because the lady that administors the test, her husband drives a Seaside '04. :D
    So I was jazzed because I was worried she would ask why the engine stalled when we stop. 8)
     
  2. bruceha_2000

    bruceha_2000 Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DaveinOlyWA\";p=\"51013)</div>
    True. WAY back, when driver's ed was part of the standard HS ciriculum in CA, we had simulators and road cars (donated by local dealers). Only the simulator had a stick. It was nice I had a clue though, as my first new car ('78 Celica) was a stick. I might not have been brave enough to go manual if I hadn't ever trained at all.
     
  3. metamatic

    metamatic Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tms13\";p=\"50902)</div>
    I can't imagine ever wanting to drive a car with manual transmission. I mean, come on people, it's the 21st Century, this is a solved problem! But no, there still seems to be some kind of macho fetish for manual transmission.

    I don't want a manual camera where I have to use a light meter and set both the shutter and aperture myself; I'm not under the illusion that it will somehow make me a better photographer. Even pro photographers use autofocus these days. The purpose of a camera is to take photographs, not to fiddle with controls. Similarly, the purpose of a car is to get from point A to point B with minimum hassle, not to have to screw around with a manual clutch.

    I also have an automatic kettle, a microwave with a timer, and a push-button telephone. No, I don't think that makes me less of a man...

    I guess if there was some sort of major disaster and I ended up in a post-apocalyptic world where all I could find to drive was an old Jeep, I'd get used to driving manually. Until then, I'll just let the car do as much of the work as possible.
     
  4. tms13

    tms13 Member

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    With Prius, we get the best of both worlds: the convenience of not having to change gear, but without the ignorance of a conventional (step) automatic. By which, I mean that it can't see the road ahead, so doesn't know whether to continue as it is or lurch into different gear. Having only one gear makes things so much simpler! :)

    I still think that even if you are willing to always buy automatics for yourself, it's foolish to be unable to drive an ordinary manual car. What if you someday need to hire a vehicle? Not many rental places do automatics, and at those that do, you'll still be out of luck if you need something too big or too small to have an auto box. Or being able to drive a friend's car? As I've done on occasion when going for a drink and not having my car but being willing to be the driver.

    The analogy with cameras is a little flawed, as automatic cameras are as cheap as manual ones. And good automatic cameras allow you to override the machine's choices when you know better - this has a parallel in the automotive world where dual-mode gearboxes are making inroads into the market. Maybe the analogy isn't as bad as I thought... ;)
     
  5. bruceha_2000

    bruceha_2000 Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(metamatic\";p=\"51296)</div>
    Hmmm, I don't think my wife is macho :) One thing that does appear to be true is that, in the same car, you lose some of the horses to the autmatic transmission. Which is why my wife got the 5 speed Legacy L wagon instead of the automatic. Gets better mileage too.
     
  6. bruceha_2000

    bruceha_2000 Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tms13\";p=\"51365)</div>
    You need to come visit the states. :) The reverse is true. It is much more difficult to find a manual rental. Maybe a cause and effect thing, fewer people can drive them and the rental places don't need their trannies ripped apart. Now, if all those people over here who have never driven a stick knew that countries they might want to visit think differently about transmissions, perhaps they would learn.

    Hmm, back to that same old problem. The U.S. doesn't know or understand that other countries are perfectly happy and getting along fine with the way they do things, even though it isn't the correct (ie. U.S.) way! ;-)
     
  7. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(metamatic\";p=\"51296)</div>
    Although your point is well taken your example is very poor. Many professional and amature photographers use manual exposure and manual focus routinely. I use them about 50% of the time b/c my ability to read exposure and to focus is still superior to what the camera can do when those things are critical. Most medium format cameras are manual focus (a few notable exceptions) and many are still full manual for exposure. I have to use a light meter for my studio lighting to be accurate.

    The point is, there is a place for these things. You won't see Grand Prix or Indy or Nascar going to auto-trannies any time soon. Although the automated world is great for the masses, when it comes to critical matters the human brain is, usually, still superior.

    As far as passenger vehicles, I agree that a manual transmission is not really necessary, it occasionally has advantages, but most people don't know when those situations are and if they did wouldn't know how to take advantage. My passion for manual transmissions died quickly once I experienced city traffic and a sore knee from using the clutch so much!
     
  8. dennisd

    dennisd New Member

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    While I adore my Prius, I do sometimes miss using a manual transmission car. Granted, auto transmissions are great on crowded freeways, stop and go city traffic and most driving we experience. On the other hand, get behind the wheel on a curvy mountain road with a stick. It is fun! When you decide to upshift, double clutch downshift, is all when you want to. Driving a car can be pure fun with a stick (and a few ponies under the hood!)
     
  9. V8Cobrakid

    V8Cobrakid Green Handyman

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    I agree with you. Mountain driving is awesome with a stick. This is why i kept my 318I.. so i can strip it down and make an awesome little race car :)
     
  10. BobA

    BobA New Member

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    My last driving test was when I needed a California Class II chauffers license to drive a twin axel milk truck... I thought getting to the DMV early would get me in and out quickly... oops.. time passed and I needed to make a delivery about the time the tester got in the truck...probably the first and only time a tester was told where and how the test would be given..

    Bob Andersen
     
  11. wb9tyj

    wb9tyj 2017 Prius Prime Advanced

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    Grew up on a stick shift...my little Ford Festiva 5speed is tooling right along at 160k miles on it and we just replaced the clutch plates...so im good for another 150k or so...but one thing, a manual comes in handy we you have to rock back and forth in snow to get yourself out of a drift...and/ or you can also push start as needed, as well...
     
  12. tms13

    tms13 Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bruceha_2000\";p=\"51367)</div>
    You need to come visit the states. :) The reverse is true.[/b][/quote]
    Yeah, I discovered that - the USA is the only place I'd driven an auto before my Prius. I spent a month working in Salt Lake City, and the auto did seem more suited to (what I saw of) the USA driving enviroment - all either stop-go city driving or steady-speed freeway cruising. Even the roads up to the ski resorts and into Canyonlands National Park were wide and gentle.

    I think Britain (and probably most of Europe) is less suited to automatics, with lots of twisty and/or steep roads that require you to be in the correct gear before starting your manoeuvre, not having the car change on you mid-overtake. On the other hand, many people drive only in the cities and the motorways connecting them, and automatics may well suit them.

    As I said in an earlier post in this thread, I love the Prius transmission because it gives the best of both worlds. It's great in queueing traffic, where it can inch along more slowly than I could manage without slipping the clutch even in my low-revving diesel car, and it's particularly good on those long uphills that are too steep to maintain momentum in third, but race the engine in second. Prius just adapts to whatever you put in its way! :D
     
  13. Tempus

    Tempus Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(metamatic\";p=\"51296)</div>
    My wife is a professional photographer.

    She certainly uses Manual Focus, Shutter and Aperture Settings, as well as a variety of light meters. Particularly for Medium and Large Format Portraits. Sometimes it can take a half hour of fiddling with the multiple Flash Units providing fill lighting to get it right.

    For Inanimate subjects, it can take a lot longer :)

    And, when doing Art Photography or Outdoor Portraiture Manual Focus and Aperture are crucial for depth of field issues.

    I prefer B&W myself and half stops in exposure can make all the difference in contrast there across the field of view especially in high contrast environments, so there's now way I can trust an auto-meter.

    I can now dodge and burn on the computer but if the detail isn't there to bring up even the computer is going to save your photo.

    When you don't have time to make all the settings, what the pros usually do with the current crop of cameras is slave one setting to another so they can get effects.

    For example a Sports Photographer might slave Shutter Speed to Aperture so they have depth of field control.

    The only professional photogs I know who go completely auto most times are photo-journalists doing coverage of things like rallys or demonstrations where they want rapid response and imperfect exposure is 'good enough'.
     
  14. tms13

    tms13 Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tempus\";p=\"51519)</div>
    [/b][/quote]
    Just to clarify, the above words are metamatic's, not mine!
     
  15. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tms13\";p=\"51505)</div>
    You need to come visit the states. :) The reverse is true.[/b][/quote]
    Yeah, I discovered that - the USA is the only place I'd driven an auto before my Prius. I spent a month working in Salt Lake City, and the auto did seem more suited to (what I saw of) the USA driving enviroment - all either stop-go city driving or steady-speed freeway cruising. Even the roads up to the ski resorts and into Canyonlands National Park were wide and gentle.

    I think Britain (and probably most of Europe) is less suited to automatics, with lots of twisty and/or steep roads that require you to be in the correct gear before starting your manoeuvre, not having the car change on you mid-overtake. On the other hand, many people drive only in the cities and the motorways connecting them, and automatics may well suit them.

    As I said in an earlier post in this thread, I love the Prius transmission because it gives the best of both worlds. It's great in queueing traffic, where it can inch along more slowly than I could manage without slipping the clutch even in my low-revving diesel car, and it's particularly good on those long uphills that are too steep to maintain momentum in third, but race the engine in second. Prius just adapts to whatever you put in its way! :D[/b][/quote]

    I used to live in SLC. What did you think of the daily grind of driving the I-215 loop, especially the logjam at the I-15 merge, or all that University of Utah traffic exiting?

    I used to drive up to Little Cottonwood and Big Cottonwood ski resorts and will agree that driving back down, a manual has better control of speed. You can downshift an automatic, but it's not the same.

    Most rental agencies in the U.S. and Canada learned a LONG time ago that unless they wanted their stick shift rentals returned with fried clutches and stripped gears, to only offer automatic transmissions. Even in large rental trucks, though to be fair the Allison World 6 speed does a pretty good job behind a large turbodiesel truck motor.
     
  16. tms13

    tms13 Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jayman\";p=\"51563)</div>
    That was never a problem, as work was out of the worst of it, in Draper, and I was accommodated in a nearby hotel - just a mile or two away. But it was 1999, and all the construction works in preparation for the Olympics were a pain when heading into town for food and entertainment of an evening. Particularly as we had a much wider car than I'm used to, and driving on the other side does bad things to your instinctive feel for the vehicle - though growing up driving on a farm means I'm fairly adaptable.

    I went up to Little Cottonwood Canyon for some limestone climbing, but didn't do the driving myself, so can't really comment on the roads there.

    I didn't realise you could get automatic boxes for goods vehicles - that's something you'd never see here!

    BTW, I think I ought to offer apologies to the original poster for dragging this thread so off-topic. :oops: Sorry!
     
  17. tms13

    tms13 Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jayman\";p=\"51563)</div>
    That was never a problem, as work was out of the worst of it, in Draper, and I was accommodated in a nearby hotel - just a mile or two away. But it was 1999, and all the construction works in preparation for the Olympics were a pain when heading into town for food and entertainment of an evening. Particularly as we had a much wider car than I'm used to, and driving on the other side does bad things to your instinctive feel for the vehicle - though growing up driving on a farm means I'm fairly adaptable.

    I went up to Little Cottonwood Canyon for some limestone climbing, but didn't do the driving myself, so can't really comment on the roads there.

    I didn't realise you could get automatic boxes for goods vehicles - that's something you'd never see here!

    BTW, I think I ought to offer apologies to the original poster for dragging this thread so off-topic. :oops: Sorry!
     
  18. metamatic

    metamatic Member

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    Oh, sure, there are some photographers who still insist on doing everything manually, just like there are some who still insist that you'll never replace film. But most pro photography isn't 6x6, and if you take a look at the cameras available for 645 and 35mm it's pretty clear that there's no real market for all-manual. In fact, even in 6x6 automation is creeping in now. Hasselblad held out the longest in avoiding auto focus, but even they gave in in 2002 and released a 645 with automation.

    So I'm sure there are photographers out there still using 70s equipment that's fully manual, but they're a dying breed.

    There's just no point sitting with a calculator working out hyperfocal settings when you can have the camera do it for you. There's no point calculating required shutter speed when you can set the aperture and have the camera work out the shutter speed (and then let you adjust the exposure). Taking longer to take the photo with the same settings is not going to lead to better photographs.
     
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