Teenagers: Dating vs. Hooking Up

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Somechic @ Jul 18 2007, 01:14 PM) [snapback]480984[/snapback]</div>

As the parent of FOUR TEENAGERS (1 female, 3 male) your post is closest to my on the ground experience here slightly north of Manhattan:

1. girls are driving the awakening to sexuality now more than boys, although boys are willing co-conspirators - they just dont have to work for it like they used to. and the girls are shockingly open about going for it. it seems to be a contest for some.

2. oral sex is huge - kids do NOT consider it as having sex (thanks mr bill). the youngest female I am aware of in my hood getting caught giving oral sex to a boy was a 7th grader (on the school bus). oral sex is more common in high school than intercourse - i dont know the exact figures but i would be 2:1. it is the "gateway" act to intercourse.

NEW TERM HERE: Rainbow Kiss - oral sex given by a girl who changes her color lipstick during the event - hence the rainbow.

3. Hooking Up - means they exchanged body fluids in some shape or form - usually denotes intercourse. there is no "just" hooking up. there at the least is intent.

4. boyfriend/girlfriend - terminology relating to a NON-sexual Non body fluid sharing relationship - any terminology beyond this means fluids are flowing.

5. there is a shocking disregard to the risks of STD's and HIV - especially amongst the girls.

anyhow, best of luck. we have found that being open and honest with the kids has been the best Rx possible. let your kids talk to you - do not be judgmental! One of the most difficult times of my entire life was when my daughter told me she had sex - i thank God i keep my gun locked up and disassembled and the bullets in a third location - like being hit by Mike Tyson in the gut - and I kept my cool and did not say a thing, react in any bad way - just said thank you for being able to talk to me about - finished the conversation - gave her a hug and kiss - went upstairs - opened the window - and realized two things:
1. my bedroom window is high enough up off the ground to cause damage upon impact, and
2. i have a real good relationship with my daughter - and still do to this day.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darwood @ Jul 18 2007, 12:48 PM) [snapback]481018[/snapback]</div>

I'm guessing that by the time a parent would "feel" their child is ready for such a discussion, they've already learned about it from their peers. Isn't it better to provide them with the knowledge rather than have it fed to them by another source, that may not be a particularly "healthy" source of information?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darwood @ Jul 18 2007, 01:48 PM) [snapback]481018[/snapback]</div>

To further on that. Always remember, the steak ALWAYS tastes better stolen. If you try to keep you kids away from it, make it bad, and you teen gets a little taste of it, ohhh its all over from there. You cant keep you kid away from it because this world is full of it. You cant do anything without the thought of sex being forced onto you. TV, peers, internet, everywhere you turn. Making sex out to be a horrible bad thing is just lying to them. As long as they are fully aware of the responsibility that comes along with it, and that the responsibility is ALWAYS there, then the mentality of sex with teens is different.

Enough with the terms. There are so many terms that I could reveal to you "old timers" ( to me anyways ) you would be second guessing if your even having sex.
Donkey punch, rusty trombone, etc... Not even going to start.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FiftyOneMPG @ Jul 18 2007, 12:41 PM) [snapback]481005[/snapback]</div>

Your message has something of a voyeuristic tone to it...

Odd.

Reminds me of when, as a high school student, I was employed by the Catholic Church, painting the dorm rooms in one of their facilities used to train Priests (it was destroyed in the Loma Prieta earthquake of '89).

I was tasked with helping to move the contents of a priest's library to his new living quarters...probably half of all his books were of a sexual nature, some were even pornographic...

It was shocking; I'll always remember how I felt when I began to notice exactly what I was packing up into boxes.

Fortunately, your remarks carry none of this duplicity.

 

"To further on that. Always remember, the steak ALWAYS tastes better stolen. If you try to keep you kids away from it, make it bad, and you teen gets a little taste of it, ohhh its all over from there."
Well said!

Rainbow Kiss.. jebus chrimany! that is the oldest most overblown scare story the media has ever come up with. (BTW- the rainbow is supposed to be because many girls with different shades of lipstick "work the room". It's absolute BS (probably based on one f**d-up party years ago), inteaded to conjure up images that fragile parents can't handle. Lipstick would not do this the way the image is portrayed, since bodily fluids would smear said "image" and no one like the taste of lipstick.

Rusty trombone...that one just makes me giggle.
How about hot carl....or dirty sanchez.

It's funny how sexual humor gets morphed into supposed reality by fear mongering folks.
We could even get into a discussion of how it's Elvis' fault, moven' his hips so suggestively...He'll turn our kids into immoral, sex crazed freaks!

"Morality smorality.. forgiddaboutit..
We're so hosed.. this country is going to fall faster than Rome ever dreamed about."

You seem to have an excess of fear and anxiety...Some Paxil perhaps is in order.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jul 18 2007, 01:28 PM) [snapback]481055[/snapback]</div>

To further the point.... What could possibly go wrong with the priest having all those porographic books? Probably nothing....

By the way... was this priest involved in the $660 million payout in LA, or maybe he was in the Boston or Chicago Catholic lottery payoffs... Nah.. I'm sure the porno is ok.. Glad you were there to help move it for him, I wouldn't want him to hurt his back carrying it.

 

This post was originally an honest request for advice on how to deal with a problem regardless of the morality of society or how women are percieved in it. While I OFTEN and STRONGLY disagree with formerVWdriver, I think it would be nice if the responses were in that vein. Maybe I'm wrong here, but I see nothing helpful in bringing up extreme examples or turning it into a morality debate. Dirty Sanchez? Come on! How is that helpful to ANYTHING?

Just my little soap box... Putting it away now.

 

Sorry! Just trying to make light of the fear mongering posts, with the hopeful benefit of relaxing VWubs fears. (As I was trying to do in my previous posts.) Besides, if they don't know, they don't need to know, as its sexual humor anyways, as opposed to a commonly practiced technique.

 

I'm 38, so perhaps a little removed from the teen scene. (And I was a very, very shy, and generally well-behaved teen---but even that didn't prevent me from "messing around" by my senior year of high school.)
Then again, I have a brother who is 18 years younger than I am... So the teen scene is sometimes closer than I'd like... generally concerning drugs, not sex; another thread, I guess.
I can't imagine many a child growing up today, that doesn't know most of the basics, and many of the um, "extras" about sex, by the time they start 7th grade. Whether peers, tv, movies, music... it is simply everywhere. And it certainly seems that "kids today" (to sound curmudgeonly!) are far and away more open and casual about sex. (The notion that oral sex "doesn't count" is a great example.)
While openness and frankness about sex is often a good thing, that usually applies to ADULTS being more open & honest about dealing with sex with eachother...! (Although... if that in fact happened more often, then perhaps the issue could be much easier to broach with their own kids?)
Having 3 sisters, I'm disturbed by the willingness of people to talk about the "sluttier girls" today... I agree with the earlier poster---some of the girls definitely push the envelope say, in dress/attitude, in relation to girls 20 years ago (who themselves were pushing their own envelope, compared to the earlier generations, and so on...) But that age-old double standard still exists, that a guy can have (and some would defend, should have) as many conquests as he can "score" (yes, let's apply a winning sports parallel to it!) without being sullied by the term "slut". So, the guys remain ever unchanged...? Universally horny, universally looking out for advantage and gettin' some. Yet it is the girls that get branded for their actions, when it always takes 2 to have sex... (And yes, exceptions exist to every rule; I realize there are 'gentlemen' out there---just seems they're not often the majority!)

I guess the puzzlement for me, is what to do about the mentality of sex as it relates to self-esteem, self-worth, etc., for both sides? How to best teach the girls, helping them to realize they can say no, and that they will in fact survive, if hot Johnny never talks to them again because of that? (Sadly, the girl who doesn't give in today, also gets branded...)
And what does the free-and-easy access to sex teach a young man about the value of sex, or the worth of the young women that "give in" so easily? That can only reinforce the notion for these young men, that they are on easy street... get what you can, and nobody slurs your name...

It is a very frightening aspect to parenthood, and daily I'm honestly relieved that I'm not having to face these troubles as a parent... Watching my own parents (dealing with my younger brother) and watching my sister (as her two little ones grow) is more than nerve-wracking enough for me!

 

"How to best teach the girls, helping them to realize they can say no, and that they will in fact survive"

They need to remember the old axiom of "why buy the cow, when you can get the milk for free?" Being called a prude should be a badge of honor, and in fact only makes them all the more desireable (forbidden fruit). Women should cherish their sexuality and make men work for it (as they have done for thousands of years). If they can't wait, they don't value you, and you shouldn't value them.

I remember my 10 year reunion well. All the supposed "popular" kids (IE: promiscous) had turned out far less successful, then the "prudish" or middle of the road kids.

 

It's not easy being a kid these days, nor is it easy being a parent. (I have two teenage daughters.) If you have to ask what they're up to, you probably don't want to know. By the time your offspring are teens, most of your parenting should have been done, and the rest is just a test to see how well you did.

 

i'm 24, so i'm not too distant from this kind of thing. i guess, above all, know your kids. give them the knowledge and the tools to make the right choices and let them choose their steps wisely. it's all you can do.

i was NOT the greatest behaved kid ever, but i got away with everything without so much as a blip on the radar. because the people i was living with had no idea who i was, they only saw what they wanted to see.

 

Dear Hubby and I have 6 kids between us.
The youngest are 19-yr old twin boys (men, actually).
Talk often, and openly, about sexual matters.

Not just the mechanics, but the emotions, the relationships, the dynamics. How girls think. How boys think. How peer pressure from outside a relationship can affect it.

Make sure that they know about safe sex, and much safer not having sex, and that they will ALWAYS be able to tell you ANYTHING.

They will test you. They may drop a conversational bomb at the dinner table, to see if you mean it when you tell them that you will listen.

It is a biological fact that, when a girl is most likely to "give in" to sexual pressure, she is also most likely to get pregnant! Make sure your kids understand basic biological facts, like the fact that the urge to reproduce is one of the strongest forces of nature.

Show your kids respect, and show their friends respect. Let them know that they have choices to make that will affect the rest of their lives, and their relationships. Let them know that they will be making those choices, and that you will always be there for them.

You might be surprised to discover that you are providing information and a listening ear for their friends, too!

One other thing that may happen, and you might think about how you would deal with it... one of your kids, or one of their friends, may tell you that they are gay, bisexual, or just really confused. It used to be, years ago, that drifting about between various genders of friends/lovers was a normal part of the adolescence phase. One's hormones are on such a rollercoaster ride, that the attraction process can, and will, strike anywhere. Your teenager may declare themselves one thing one day, and then the next, find themselves strongly attracted to the opposite. If you can maintain a composure that doesn't go off the deep end, that's so much the better! yes, they may end up, as adults, in a relationship that you would not have picked, but at least you will still have a relationship with your child, and won't have the pain and anguish of huge, unhealed wounds in the family (I have too many gay friends whose families went berserk on them).
Now, it seems that people are either going to try to "beat the gay out of them", or go to the other extreme, and declare themselves a PFLAG family, wave a rainbow flag, and either way, the kid may have changed their mind!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darwood @ Jul 18 2007, 12:03 PM) [snapback]481086[/snapback]</div>

Sorry, Darwood. You got mentioned, but you probably weren't the focus of that post. There was at least one other term used which I wish with every fiber of my being I had never asked the meaning of. I won't re-type it, or pass that knowledge along - some things you DON'T want to learn. Unfortunately, in today's society, I wish that I could believe that anything conceived as "sexual humor" WASN'T being used out there somewhere, probably in a horrible and demeaning fashion. I would sleep better.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(formerVWdriver @ Jul 18 2007, 01:16 PM) [snapback]481161[/snapback]</div>

Fair - but I suspect the only reason some of the terms being bandied about didn't horrify and/or offend you is that you were fortunate enough not to know what they mean. I honestly wish that I didn't - my life would be better off without that knowledge.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(eclectcmoi @ Jul 18 2007, 01:47 PM) [snapback]481016[/snapback]</div>

Hmm, In my day 1979 - 1988 as a teen, you would here of freinds having sex from 16 & up....

Today they are becoming sexual active at 9 & 10 as a starting age.. (to top it off they think its ok) :blink:

I remember watching Oprah on the topic of sexually active teens starting at 12 and the kids had some education on sex to the point they where having oral & anal sex instead of risking getting inpregnated by having vaginal sex. :mellow:

Most teens do not have the luxury of having condoms availible..

Per Oprah most teen girls dont give oral/BJs a second thought is becoming as normal as a hand-shake..
IE: Freinds with Benifits....... Does anyone else see a downward spiral here?

Hell when I was a kid the only teen girls that had big boobs were fat. Now due to hormones in the food most teen girls have racks so to speak....

I recently spoke to my niece who was wearing daisy duke shorts and a 1/2 top, I aked her if she realized that old men where looking at her as well as the boys in her 14-15 yr old age bracket? LOL she got this sick look on her face and changed into normal shorts and a t-shirt.

EYE OPENER: :huh:

This is real, I wonder how bad it will become before it goes full circle..? :mellow:

 

Interesting stuff HyCam...

On the upside, more and more states and districts are getting rid of abstinance education and focusing more on teaching our kids(at younger ages) how to do all of those thing mentioned.

One man & One woman waiting until marriage... now that's a terrible design and expectation for society. It would lead to way too many in-wedlock births. Do we really want children with two parents? If each person was only ever with their marriage partner, how would society spread STD's?

It would ruin a whole segment of the medical and pharmacudical industries. We can't emphasis 'waiting for marriage' in our schools to our children. Who are we to impose our morals on them? After all, we want our kids to have fun. I can't say for myself because I've never had ghonorea, but from what I've heard, it's a blast. A real hoot, I'm sure..

 

If you live in fear, the terrorists have already won!
Or do you like their Taliban style teachings on human sexuality?

Anyone can pull out shocking stories and try to extrapolate them to infer that "EVERY kid is doing this!" And EVERY MARKETING dept. in the world (including in the news rooms) understand that there are 2 things that SELL products or agendas: SEX and FEAR. When you put the 2 into one story, you've hit the jackpot!

"Per Oprah most teen girls dont give oral/BJs a second thought is becoming as normal as a hand-shake"
Note...PER OPRAH, who's goal is viewership of scared soccor moms and is an expert on what?

"Today they are becoming sexual active at 9 & 10 as a starting age"
OK. So you're saying no one in history has done this and only now has this occurred? Look up Johnny Appleseed and his arranged marriage with a 10 year old. And there is NO attempt to quantify the trend. More BS media fear mongering.

"Now due to hormones in the food most teen girls have racks so to speak"
Huh??? What does this have to do with railing on US morals (caused of course by the Clintons). I'm sure the advent of the wonder bra and related "enhancing undergarments" have nothing to do with this. Are you looking that close to notice, you perv.!

which leads to ...
"old men where looking at her as well as the boys in her 14-15 " Yes, they have always done that. The term "dirty old man" is not a new term. But, 40 years ago, media did not report molestation stories, so few people heard about it. Now these stories sell like friggen hot cakes! And we all think some terrible epidemic of debauchery is taking over the country. This is right of the playbook that brought you "reefer madness", Orson Wells, the nuclear scare of the 70's, etc. "Mexican's and Jazz musicians on mari-hauna will rape your daughter!"

"Girls as young as 11 are stacking colorful rubber "sex bracelets" Allright! More rainbow parties!
"as young as" ONE 11 year old girl had to have done this for this statement to be true. That's all.

"two-thirds of all STDs occurring in people under age 25. This is because young people are more likely to be more sexually active and take more risks"
DUhhhh!!! Human libido rises rapidly after puberty and declines for the REST of our lives. Adults are typically in a committed relationship, hence, no more risk of STD's. This statistic is completely expected and does not show morality to be spiraling into hell. As for the "rising rates of STD's: this was a LOCAL story. STD rates ALWAYS rise and fall in LOCAL areas, it's how viral populations move, just like flu rates do the same thing.

"a large number of young girls started asking for emergency contraception. Teen Sex Parties"
DRUGS! TERRORIST! CANCER" AIDS! VD! GLOBAL WARMING! AFRICAN KILLER BEES!

PLEASE.....BE AFRAID! (it helps sell product, pass agendas, prevents uprisings and increases your stress levels and health problems, which is good for the economy).

(I am NOT advocating promiscuity, only noting that NONE of this is new, only the prevalance in the media (and public pyche) of it is new.)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FiftyOneMPG @ Jul 19 2007, 10:48 AM) [snapback]481694[/snapback]</div>

Hormones teach the kids quite enough...
And teaching of morality belongs at home. It isn't the school's job to teach your kids your morals.
Scientifically accurate biology is the school's job, and parent's have also, through the years and through school boards, handed the job of Sex Ed to the schools. The school has an obligation to teach it as biologically accurately as possible.

Keeping those lines of communication open with your kids is your only real hope. If they think (know?) that you will start preaching if they raise a question about sexuality, they aren't going to ask you, or respect your morals.