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Tesla climbs to number 3 in world wide plug-in sales

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by austingreen, Aug 26, 2014.

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  1. Ashlem

    Ashlem Senior Member

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    And I'm surprised how well the PiP is selling despite only being available in a few states. I wonder what those numbers would look like if they were sold nationwide.

    Another part of me suspects the PiP was partly for compliance, and as a testbed for how reliable a plug-in would be for Toyota. They probably lose a little money on every one they sell, which may also explain why it's not available everywhere in the US.

    That, or they may not want PiP to eat into the regular prius sales, hence its somewhat limited availability.
     
    #21 Ashlem, Sep 3, 2014
  2. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    I think we can throw away the idea that toyota loses money on each phv sale. Tesla's batteries cost less than $300/kwh, toyota's must at most cost $600. Say waranty battery costs are really high and 25% need to be replaced. That still is only $3300. Add $1000 for the charger upgraded inverter, heated seats and you get $4300 in added costs. Now take off the off $500 in costs for the nimh battery and spare tire and we get $3800 (and I bet costs are lower than that). The MSRP of the phv is $4200 more than than the prius 3 trim, so there should be at least $400 in extra profit to divide between corporate and the dealers. If the 3 trim makes money the phv should.

    Now yes it doesn't pay much into those fixed R&D costs, but toyota should make more of a profit on every prius phv than on a prius liftback.

    There is no good explanation why toyota doesn't at least do the ford plan, of allowing dealers in other states sell it if they want. I understand there is dealer push back about learning a new car and hating plug-ins, which may be why there is not a nation wide roll out, but why not texas and georgia and florida?
     
    #22 austingreen, Sep 3, 2014
  3. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    You can't even get a PiP in the states where they're suppose to be available. :eek:
     
    #23 El Dobro, Sep 7, 2014
  4. Troy Heagy

    Troy Heagy Member

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    In my opinion a Plugin hybrid needs to have enough range so that it spends all its time in EV mode for the average American (except long trips of course). Otherwise it has to startup the engine & make Cold-start pollution (dirty). 15000 miles annual average would be 30 miles minimum range to get to work.
     
    #24 Troy Heagy, Sep 10, 2014
  5. Chazz8

    Chazz8 Gadget Lover

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    Cold start pollution is minimized by Prius vehicles by using the traction battery as much as possible and running the Internal combustion engine (ICE) in the most efficient and clean (minimal load) way possible during ICE warmup. Note that if you floor the gas pedal to get maximum acceleration during ICE warmup, then you will get that dirty cold start pollution you mentioned.

    The plug in Prius has a bigger traction battery so it is better than the other Prius to minimize cold start pollution.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong.
     
    #25 Chazz8, Sep 10, 2014
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  6. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Yes, the Prius is good at minimizing start up pollution because it is good at minimizing start up time. It is better at it than the Volt and Ford hybrids. It has to be in the case of the plug in though when compared to the other plug in hybrids. Its shorter EV range and lower ICE start threshold mean the engine will start up more often than the others on an identical drive. Depending on the specifics of that drive, they may not have to start the ICE at all.

    Everybody doesn't have the same drive. So PHVs with differing EV range will work better for some, but not others. Looking back, the PPI will probably be deemed to have too low an EV range for market penetration though.
     
    #26 Trollbait, Sep 11, 2014
  7. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    We now have good statistics about the volt's 38 mile range, 81% of trips didn't turn the ice on, go to 50 miles of range and they may get higher. Some people seem fine on the 19 mile range ford energis.
    GM Exec: "Better In Every Way" 2nd Gen Chevrolet Volt "Media Encounters" Coming Soon - Video | Inside EVs
     
    #27 austingreen, Sep 11, 2014
    El Dobro and Ashlem like this.
  8. Ashlem

    Ashlem Senior Member

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    I have to admit, those are some nice stats. If Volt 2.0 has an even longer range, and more room inside to fit stuff (aka hatchback-like), and a lower price, I may have to seriously consider it. For me it's about 19 miles one way to work, so theoretically I could make it to work and back (no charging available at work, for now...), especially utilizing hybrid techniques such as pulse & glide. I also get a discount on GM/Chevy/Ford/Nissan vehicles at work, so I may have to use that...

    I just hope their reliability/maintenance costs are low like most priuses are. That's mostly what kept me away from buying the volt, since Chevy's reliability isn't quite on par with Toyota's. I'm not too worried about resale value since I intend to keep the vehicles I buy for 5-10 years, but I certainly don't want a lemon either.
     
    #28 Ashlem, Sep 11, 2014
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