The complexity of the touch screen car

I recentl got a Camry hybrid. It has a few knobs, radio tuning and volume, and HVAC temp for driver and passenger. It also has a few buttons, but not a lot. The touch screen, and steering wheel controls do radio presets and a few other things, and cruise control. Overall, not bad.

SM-G950U using PriusChat mobile app

 

I would question how much gas is really being saved by turning the A/C off, if you are trying to maintain a temperature in the cabin that is similar to that outside the car. With an automatic HVAC that switches from heating to A/C depending on where the HVAC temperature is set vs. the current cabin temperature and outside temperature, I would think that if the cabin temperature and HVAC setting and outside temperature are all similar, the automatic A/C may be doing nothing, so no gas would be saved by turning it off. Certainly if the outside temperature is higher or lower than the temperature setting on the HVAC, gas could be saved by turning the A/C off, but I'm not sure you would want to do that anyway. Both your own comfort and the HV battery's comfort depend on your maintaining a moderate cabin temperature.

The Gen 4 car does have a separate button for "A/C" not just for "Auto A/C", so it seems likely that A/C could be turned on and off by using a voice command, although the manual doesn't have a complete list of voice commands, so I cannot be sure. (If anyone has that list, I would be most interested in getting it). I thought a voice command might be the solution for turning the A/C off on the Gen 2 as well, but I don't see a command for "A/C off" on my list of commands (attached), although there is one for "Automatic Air Conditioning" on or off, but I guess that does the same thing as the button on the steering wheel.

 

At some point you wind up with a keyboard on the steering wheel. Control-H for horn is too slow for certain situations.

One of my favorite cars only has a horn and cruise control buttons on the wheel. Fewer controls momentarily inaccessible due to wheel angle.

 

I live in New England where we do not have scorching temps for too long. So in spring, early summer, late summer and fall I like to drive without AC most of the time and the windows down when not on highway. When on highway I roll the windows up and turn the AC on. This is easily accomplished with the steering wheel button. When I get off the highway and have about a 20 minute ride through the countryside I roll down the windows (that are not a touchscreen control, thank heavens!) and want to turn the AC off. I am ok with 80's outside and windows down. I like the breeze of the natural air. Keeping the AC on at this point is wasteful and I can report as much as 10% fuel economy difference on a hot day. So turning off AC is a common enough task for me that I get annoyed with how it was implemented on my Gen2. Buttons aren't always great either, as mentioned in previous posts. The interface needs to be simple, logical and tactile in nature. Most of the steering wheel controls on Gen2 Prius are great and make the touchscreen less annoying to live with, but if any more functions are relegated to the touchscreen it would make me very uncomfortable. I simply do not enjoy operating a touchscreen, even on my phone. It is not a pleasant interface. Voice commands are better, but what if you need to be quiet (sleeping baby)? I think we are trying to solve a problem with technology that does not exist. Knobs buttons and levers well designed and placed have been around for decades and work great and are appropriate for the application. There is no problem with them that needs solving. Touchscreen/voice command interface is a solution looking for a problem.

 

We rarely if ever use the AC through summer. Just roll down the windows. A lot of our drives are short, so it's kinda pointless. Mostly use it in winter, when it's raining, to dispel windshield fog. Just as a last resort. I'd concur on that 10% hit.

 

Model 3 peeps, how would you feel if the window controls were on the touchscreen? Or, wait! ARE THEY?! What about horn? Turn signals? Headlights? High beams?

I am pushing the line to make a point, please don't kill me. The point I am trying to make is that there is a line at which it becomes uncomfortable and even unreasonable. Well, that line is different for old timers that have shaky hands, poor near range vision, unease of using a touch screen in general (no feedback), etc. For me that line is at the very presence of a touchscreen in the car. I think a touchscreen is a poor interface popularized by iPhone (and it's not that great at it there, but it's the best we got for a small device that does everything), but completely inappropriate for a non-autonomous vehicle.

 

Touch screens are useful to solve certain problems. They're tough, easy to clean, easy to change the controls available and cheap. When you have no idea what controls you're going to need and nowhere near enough space to show them all, they offer a way out of an otherwise hopeless situation.

With a phone, you get to use both hands to improve your aim. You'll subtly and automatically shift the hand holding the phone to improve the aim of the finger tapping the screen. You don't get that bilateral control refinement benefit with a touchscreen anchored to a workstation like a car cockpit. Easy to see why Tesla did a giant screen- they needed the area to get it as good as it is.

You asked what would happen if the window controls were on the touch screen. What if the doorknob was there too? The seatbelt release? the seat adjustments?

I'm sure controls are very crude when the engineers are laying out the parts for any given car. Somebody has to jack in a laptop and type out "LowbeamHeadlights.true" on the terminal etc. Yes, a touchscreen is an improvement from that.

Tactile controls that never change their location or orientation (except to explicitly reflect current mode selection) have a real advantage that can't ever be replicated by a single touch-screen. It is clearly not impossible to make a car without them, but I think it's an awfully big benefit to trade away, especially when it isn't enough to enable an ultra-low pricetag on the resulting car.

In fairness- I haven't driven one. But from afar, it looks like Tesla wants to cash in on the "bigger dashboard tv = better' side of the equation without admitting that they're masking a fairly basic inadequacy.

 

No need to make that point. I would also argue that there is a line at which touchscreens become unreasonable.
For this old timer, with bad vision and shaky hands, we haven’t reached that point yet. For you, they may have passed it.
I have an easier time controlling the specifics of the HVAC with the touch screen of the Model 3 than I did in my former Prius 2.
Most specifically, the dial that selected the mode (defrost, fan at floor, face, etc).

Simple on or off, the button was better, but only by a little.
To Turn AC on, I just press the AC spot on the touchscreen. Most of the time I don’t even have to look at the screen as it is located in the center of the screen right along the bottom. To turn it off, I hit that spot twice.
All the icons for defrost and such are much larger than they were on the Prius 2 dial and always only a single click away.

The other factor, that has not yet been discussed, is the vast amount of info now included in cars. For navigation I want a display large enough to see with a momentary glance. I actually prefer some of it to be on the windshield as a HUD. A large screen gives less real estate for dials, sliders and knobs. Auto makers have two choices, make a smaller display and juggle around buttons, or make a larger display and move controls to the display.

There are also more items to control.
How do you control turning on/off the traction control?
How about the car alarm?
Heated seats?
Fog lights?
Child locks?
Mirror adjustment?

Would you add the dozens of navigation controls as buttons on the dash somewhere?

It is easy to take either side to an extreme.

My point is, some of us are quite happy and comfortable with the UI in the Model 3.
You aren’t, that’s fine. You don’t have to use it. Buy the car that works for you.

 

I agree that steering wheel buttons moving around with the wheel reduces the convenience of using them. The one time I've especially noticed this is when a call is coming in and I am trying to locate the "Answer phone" button before it goes to voice-mail and it is not in its usual position because the wheel is turned. I can see how this could be responsible for many accidents. It is nice that you have the option of answering the phone by hitting a button on the MFD, but that is only slightly less distracting. I know, I know, most of the time one would be better off not answering the phone at all if it increases the likelihood of an accident, but there are always times when it is exceptionally important to pick up the phone right away. The other buttons on the steering wheel for controlling the audio and climate and navigation systems never require that they be located with any urgency, so having them move with the steering wheel is not really a problem, you can wait for the steering wheel to be centered again before manipulating them. The one thing I really don't get is that the cruise control stalk moves with the steering wheel. Why did Toyota choose that design for their cars? Is there a technical reason? Why doesn't it remain in one place like the turn signal and light switch stalks?

I can believe that there is a 10% difference in fuel economy when the A/C is working at its hardest, but that is usually only at the beginning of your trip on a hot day. After a few minutes, the cabin temperature is reduced to the point where the A/C doesn't have to work that hard, unless you are directly facing the sun. Under those conditions you wouldn't want to drive without the A/C anyway, at least on the East Coast with this high humidity all summer long. (West Coast doesn't count, @Mendel Leisk. You guys don't know what summer humidity is). If you are comparing MPG on a hot day on the East Coast vs. a relatively cool day, sure there is a 10% difference, but that is comparing apples and oranges.