They want to tax hybrids in WA

hehe

 

The semi has 18 wheels and the Leaf 4. Your semi tax should be reduced by 45%. Or should go by tire contact patch surface area.

Any modern car, traveling at the common road speeds, contributes to road wear. EVs are currently getting to use public roads for virtrually free. While it might be too soon, with their recent introduction, to be doing, it is a topic that will have to be addressed.

 

Interesting. Do you have a link to the study ?

 

Except for possible disagreement over wheels vs axles, it matches statements in some of the introductory freshman engineering materials to which I was exposed, in a prior century.

Not being a mechanical or materials engineer, I don't have a link to supply.

 

At least they still have an ongoing pension program.

Many of us in private industry who once had pension programs, had them frozen long ago, before we could reach the late career stage where the real bulk of their value was to accrue.

Or we were downsized en masse. Same result.

 

Sounds like Oregon might be listening to the pay by the mile theory:
"The state of Oregon is considering charging electric vehicle drivers for every mile they drive, to offset lost gasoline taxes."

Oregon: Electric car drivers should pay special tax | San Francisco Business Times

 

This sort of weight damage addresses only part of the road costs. Some costs are more related to weather and age, others are related to traffic volume and congestion, and still others are more constant, independent of traffic or aging. These portions are more fairly divided by other measures.

No single measure produces an equitable cost allocation.

 

That is not what the literature on the subject says (for example):
Generalized Fourth Power Law

The AASHTO load equivalency equation is quite cumbersome and certainly not easy to remember. Therefore, as a rule-of-thumb, the damage caused by a particular load is roughly related to the load by a power of four (for reasonably strong pavement surfaces). For example, given a flexible pavement with SN = 3.0 and pt = 2.5:

1. A 18,000 lb (80 kN) single axle, LEF =1.0
2. A 30,000 lb (133 kN) single axle, LEF = 7.9
3. Comparing the two, the ratio is: 7.9/1.0 = 7.9
4. Using the fourth power rule-of-thumb:

Thus, the two estimates are approximately equal.

 

I'm satisfied that the semi is definitely contributing to far more wear even if we cannot agree on the numbers. It's like would you rather be punched in the stomach gently 10 times or once hard. I'd go for 10 times gently.

Agree with fuzzy too that there is more to just road wear. For example, somebody has to pay for the pet projects that benefit a few campaign lobbyists, right?

 

The latest:

Washington considers annual flat fee for electric cars - Wire - State & Regional - bellinghamherald.com

 

Below is a response to a letter I sent Senator Steve Hobbs (WA) about the bill that they are trying to pass in Washington State. If you look at his response and the number of "plug-in" vehicles he says are in Washington State currently and that they plan on taxing, something just doesn't sound right. The problem is the bill states if the there is an gas engine besides batteries there wouldn't be a flat tax on the vehicle. How many of those 1,316 do you think are plug-in Prius (after market) or other similar models that they are planning to tax and not true EV's? Seems to me their figures and plan are skewed already. Are there really 1,316 EV's in Washington State in 2010?



I appreciate that you have taken the time to contact me regarding SB 5251. We are all part of the legislative process and your input matters. The purpose of this bill is not to give bad publicity to electric cars. People are buying electric cars not primarily for savings at the pump, but for the all of the positive environmental reasons. Electric cars are very expensive and not everyone can afford them, but everyone else has to pay for their use of the system. This is a good way for electric vehicles to pay their fair share.

Most of the miles driven by electric vehicles are local and it might be logical if some of the funds were made available for cities and this fee allows for this. I have heard that people against this bill believe that any fees on electric cars should be based on miles driven, we simply do not have the means to monitor that at this point. This $100 fee is in lieu of gas tax, and the equivalent that a person pays in a gas powered car is $325 annually.

All of us using cars on the road pay a fee for preserving and maintaining our highways. About 1,316 plug-in vehicles were registered in Washington in 2010, according to the state Office of Financial Management, and that number is expected to increase to about 17,202 vehicles by 2020. This bill is projected to bring in roughly $468,000 over the next two years if the bill is enacted. This money will help us in keeping our roads intact at home in the 44th. I appreciate your input on this matter and welcome any future feedback. Please feel free to contact me again if I can be of any further assistance. Thanks.

Take care,
Steve

 

Hi All,

Well, EV's need to pay a road tax. If this tax is that, then so be it.

But if its a tax on vehicles that get better gasoline MPG, then its wrong. Because, a vehicle with higher mielage wears on the roads less. No mater what FELT specifies, if it cost what it costs, those who benefit should pay.

 

Was discussing this with DH this morning on our way to meet our newest grandbaby...

NOTE: This is all conjecture, extrapolation, and opinionation on my part.

When gas taxes were put in place, it was a fairly even-handed way to tax users of the roads & highway systems. Larger, heavier vehicles which pound the pavement more pay more taxes, as they have lower MPGs. Smaller, lighter vehicles or vehicles that drive a lot less, pay less tax, as they are adversely affecting the pavement less. So, the tax is a round-about way of taxing based on usage. It doesn't really allow for the variations in "performance" vehicles, which have "large, load-bearing, heavy usage" MPG, even if they aren't as hard on the pavement. I can't think of any really large, load-bearing, heavy usage vehicles with "light or minimal usage" MPG.
Well, except for those really, really large diesel-electric hybrids that haul tons of cargo, but since they run on their own rail-road ways, they aren't part of the discussion.

At the moment, I don't see EVs putting the kind of wear & tear on the pavement as other vehicles, but I can see this issue becoming an emotionally taxing one, when you start getting gas-buying people thinking about how badly "EVs" are "abusing the road system" without paying gas taxes. *double-deep sigh* News stories will only make it worse.

I really wish Washington would go back to having the license registration fee reflect the value of the vehicle, rather than this "flat fee" fiasco that was foisted on us by Tim Eyman. The millions of dollars in revenue that supported parks, rec, public transit, and helped with infrastructure is sorely missed now.

Anyway, that's my $0.02 worth. Take it or leave it. YMMV.