"Tookie" Williams, Thumbs Up or Down?

REformed NO way not in prison, he jsut learned to be a better crimminal, He murdered 3 we are wasting time talking about it I say thumbs down he gets the punishment he deserves FRY HIM

 

Why would you think he is reformed?

Many people in California feel that with Schwartzeneggar's past relationship with Tookie he should not have intervened even though its his right.

 

All of a sudden PC seems to have taken a conservative tone. I'm pleasantly surprised.

 

Send all the rapists, murderers, and most all child molesters/abusers to me. I'll take care of them for $50 a pop. With a smile on my face too. That'll save some cash.

We have become too soft on criminals. I was just reading about Gary Stardust (I think that's his name). He's on the run from Vietnamese officials becuase he reportedly sexually abused two young girls. Vietnam executes for sexual child abuse. I applaud them.

Tookie is a killer. No amount of time and no amount of appeals and no amount of money will ever change that. Give him what he desrves. Actually, let's ask his victims what should happen to him. Oh, wait... THEY'RE DEAD! Give him the needle.

 

The likelihood that he will kill again should be taken into account; 'good works' after the fact is completely besides the point. This talk about being reformed is interjecting christian notions into a law case.

If the fellow was caucasian, how much discussion would the country be having ? How much would the black community in LA care ?

 

Its a proven fact that the death penalty drops the recidivism rate to absolute zero.

I'm no fan of the death penalty because of the inevitability of caprice and mistake. But that doesn't mean I think Stanley Williams has "redeemed" himself. He deserves to be killed, raised from the dead, killed, raised from the dead, killed, raised from the dead and then killed once and for all.

I don't have sympathy for him or any other murderer who is executed, but then I suppose an eternity of being eaten by worms in a fire that "burns but does not consume" is punishment enough. So I can say with sincerity that I hope God has mercy upon his soul.

He is unrepentent because he still claims his innocence. Fair enough. But he and his supporters have appropriated religious language without going to the trouble of actually having a religious conversion, which in any other context would be considered hypocritical. "Redeemed". If he can raise the victims from the dead, and then apologize to them for the last thing they heard -- a racial slur -- just before he shot them, then perhaps we can talk about "redemption".

His crime was a racially motivated hate crime, evidenced by the racial slur used as he shot-gunned the victims ("Buddah-heads!") He is no better than any Klansman engaging in a lynching, not of a single innocent man, but of a family. It is truly an outrage that people like Jesse Jackson cuddle up to him, and praise his ghost-written children's books. The Klansman's hood fits all human heads too well for my comfort.

He bragged about "offing" the "Buddah-heads", revealing a far too common prejudice in the Black community against Asian Americans. His hatred is played out every day on the mean streets of LA, with good and noble people hiding inside their homes because there are too many "Tookies" outside, ready and willing to victimize them.

Our Governor will not commute his sentence or grant him clemancy. The announcement will come at night, after the papers are put to bed, so that the media will not have a field day with the story. They will anyway. We will be treated to the unseemly spectacle of those clamoring for his death and those clamoring for him to live because of his good deads. Meanwhile, there are four people still very, very dead, and no one will remember them.

 

Has anyone considered what the reaction will be on the streets of LA if he is put to death? Are we going to see more dying as a result? What a country we live in. We kill to prove what? That we can? It does nothing but stir up more emotions and in todays climate it could only create more deaths. Whether or not it is done by criminals or the government, it just plain isn't right. Period. When are we going to learn that simple fact? Just my opinion.

 

A killer is a killer no matter the color of his skin. If he were white, asian, latino, it doesn't matter to me. Give him the punishment he deserves.

 

Simple fact: Our government's primary funtion is to protect its citizens from being "forced" to give up "life", liberty or pursuit of happiness. That is, to protect us from forces without and within. Government doesn't kill to "prove" anything. Government must provide justice for those whose individual rights are violated. Justice is served when a person guilty of "forcing another person to die" is in turn punished by being "forced to surrender his life". If justice is denied, it becomes progressively easier to ignore the personal consequences of such action.

The sure knowledge that "justice" wil be administered is a deterrent - that is, the dead offender will be deterred from repeating the offense. Consistently appied justice most certainly is a deterrent (IMHO) for those who have yet to kill - but, many will disagree. Consistency has been largely absent from our current system of justice.

Heres hoping Gov. Doyle will sign the legislation which reinstates the death penaty in Wisconsin. If not, he'll be a one-term Gov.

Re: Tookie's books. Has anyone mentioned that total sale of his first kids book was 330 copies, and of his second book - 3 copies. Nobel Prize stuff fer sher!

http://newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/12/13/90532.shtml

Denny....Fox Cities, WI

 

Yes, nothing will change if Stanley "Tookie Wiliams is executed, but he must pay the price for the thousands of lives he and the Crips have taken away.
We can debate about Tookie Williams until our faces turn blue. This is a political issue with no right answer, my answer or your answer is not right, But we have a state law passed by the majority of voters in the State of California that supports the execution of a convicted murderer and supported by the Democrat controlled State Assembly, Democrat controlled State Senate and a Republican Governor. The law is correct and enforced until it's overturned by the U.S. Supreme Court.

Political Science 101. NIMBY, stands for Not In My Back Yard. Means stay out of my back yard. Local people know their issues more than an outsider.
Tookie and I are from California and you are from another state. The mass majority of Californian's support the execution of Stanley "Tookie" Williams.

 

Gee, I guess that only people from CA. should post on this topic!! :angry: By the way, South Dakota also has the death penalty. Just because my state has less people, does not mean terrible things don't happen here or that people from other states don't have the right to express their thoughts. I understand this is an emotional issue for you, so I will give you a midwestern/northern plains nod of my head and wish you well.

 

Panther87,
Yes this an emotional issue for me because I lived in a Crips neighborhood before.
I'm not saying people from other states can express their own thoughts on Tookie. What I'm stating is Tookie Williams has had a direct impact on thousands of innocent people here in Los Angeles, CA and we deal with it on a daily basis.
So, of course the majority people in Southern California will support the execution of Tookie Williams, well maybe not Snoop Dog or Michael Jackson...

Panther87, don't get too mad! because I'm sure their are plenty of topics we will agree on besides the execution of Tookie, So I'll give you a laid back West Coast
peace sign and chat with you on a more fun subject in Prius Chat. Take care.

 

Maybe we need to go way back to either public exicution by hanging or barbaric midevel torture to make people think about the consiquence of thier actions. Wasn't it in Japan that they would cut off a finger for each robery. That's extreeme but maybe an arm for murder. But then if you handicap someone too much they need special assistance from tax payers for the rest of thier lives.

Maybe the best way to cut down on crime is to go into the most crime-ridden areas (the poorest) and give everyone enough money to jump-start thier lives. Maybe move out of the ghetto and get a new house. The educated people will put the money to good use and better themselves while the rest will O.D. on drugs. But, as we all know money isn't the key to happiness. There are plenty of wealthy people who want more.

Now I'm thinking SciFi. Maybe in the future there will be safe zones. Cities built for non-violent people with a clean history. So, instead of locking up the bad guys we lock ourselves up (away from them). You commit a crime, you get booted out of the country club. It won't be expensive, so it's not only for the rich. It only matters that you don't scew up.

There's my screwed up brain smoking again. Can you smell it?

 

I live in NY. I say fry the SOB.

 

I'm not sure poverty and crime are really linked. The stats since the 1960s seem to say so, but prior to that time the link wasn't statistically significant. What did happen in the 1960's is that we started giving poor people money, and in fact gave them more if Dad wasn't around. The financial incentive was to remain unmarried, or move out, to get the "free" government money.

We also started thinking that women could do everything a man could do, including being a father to a boy.

So today, the most common denominator among killers is that they didn't have a father in the home. Huge correllation, with some very high percentage (can't remember the exact number, but its above 80%). Some argue that the welfare society actually helped create this problem, but that may be going too far. We do know that a boy that has a father in the home becomes a better man. And we know that daughters are much more likely to avoid pregnancy before marraige if there's a dad in the home too. Makes sense really ... kids need both a father and a mother.

Prior to the spread of welfare and drugs and fatherless homes, the black community was not over-represented in jails and prisons as they are now. They have been decimated by the events of the last 40 years, just at the time that civil rights finally provided more equal opportunity than they had ever seen. Its like a Greek tragedy, really.

The LAPD does not expect any violence if the evil Mr. Williams is executed. Most of the gang members today don't know him, and many were not even born when he committed his crimes. Besides which, most of them don't care when a neighbor lies bleeding on the sidewalk. Their main concern is who "got the bones".

 

A Japanese Yakuza or mafia member must cut off his own pinky to renounce his membership to the mafia. Sort of similar to a gangster in Los Angeles being jumped out of a gang. The Yakuza member must cut off his finger as show of disrespect after being punished by the mafia.

How about the Chinese water drop torture B) .

 

LA Freeway,

I do live in a gang infested neighborhood here in Los Angeles, but I don't believe in the death penalty for anyone, including Stanley Williams. If our country believes life is so sacred then our government should not be in the business of legal, government implemented, murder.

I don't really believe Williams is reformed, he has just honed his skills of manipulation to a fine art and duped a lot of well-meaning people (and others who are opportunistic). In his most recently released public statement he said something to the effect that if he lives he will work with others to create an gang prevention curriculum. He's just NOW thinking about such a thing? He also hasn't taken responsibility for any of his past actions, which makes all of his writings and proclaimations ring even more hollow.

I don't think government sanctioned murder is the answer. Let him rot in jail.

I'm also sick of our local news outlets going on and on about this. They continually ratchet up the rhetoric of violence and riots if the Gropenfuhrer does not commute his sentence. Shame on them.

One more thing, you don't have to live in LA or even CA to have a valid opinion on this!

 

I wonder how much it cost the taxpayers of CA to keep this guy alive for 24 years on death row? I'm for the needle. If this guy gets life, he'll still be a burden on those taxpayers.

Awating my '06!