Featured Toyota bZ4X Specifications Revealed

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by Tideland Prius, Oct 29, 2021.

  1. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    I don't think we have hard data but the last estimate I saw was in the 14 year range. But it's probably going up as car prices go up. The average car on US roads today is 12.1 years old.
     
  2. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Median now has risen to 12.1 years on American roads. Lots of old pick up trucks in the tail end. My Lexus met its demise at 11 years with a car accident where the insurance company decided its parts were worth more than the wrecked car. Some cars that can't be sold used in the US are sold in other countries so they may be still on the road and not counted. Japan does this a lot more than the US.

    Median has increased a lot in the last 20 years. Friend put a lot of repair money into keeping his 4 runner for 20 years, wife finally convinced him to sell. It had sentimental value and still was great off road. Some people will replace the batteries, who knows what they will cost in a bz4x 12 years from now, but I expect replacement cost will be lower than all those 4 runner repairs. Used car prices are very high right now with the chip shortage so I expect the median to increase before it decreases again.
     
  3. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    That's median age of current cars, not median lifespan.
     
  4. mr88cet

    mr88cet Senior Member

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    Generally not, but OK, yes, maybe an Indy car would have been a better comparison.
     
  5. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    https://www.racingcircuits.info/north-america/usa/circuit-of-the-americas.html#.YZe-TWDMKZQ

    There are very sharp curves at COTA in austin used for F1 and formula E, as there are on other F1 tracks. I've ridden my bike and run on the track and was surprised how sharp turn 15 is, forcing me to slow way down on a bicycle. IIRC Monaco has the tightest turn in F1. Not very important as I don't expect that Yoke to make it to america.


    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Hicksite

    Hicksite Member

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    I will respectfully disagree; most F1 courses have at least a few tight turns, at least the ones I have seen.

    Agree that Indy car (or NASCAR) would have been a better example, although both run at least one or two races per season on a road course.
     
  7. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    A tight turn in this context is a turn into a parking place in a narrow parking lot. F1 car tracks don't have 90 degree turns in 15 feet.
     
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  8. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Such turns are at lower speeds, so the ability to make the turn without taking your hands off the wheel is less critical.
     
  9. Hicksite

    Hicksite Member

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    That’s not the context my post was addressing.
     
  10. drash

    drash Senior Member

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    Here’s a bit of insight into a deep dive from the Toyota European site: https://newsroom.toyota.eu/download/1114063/bzdeepdivescript.pdf

    Doesn’t quite go into details that you would expect, but there are some nuggets:

    First they (Toyota Europe) are going to provide a 1,000,0000 km (about 621,000 miles) battery care provided you get it annually checked at a Toyota workshop. To them, it’s equivalent with 2,200 charges from zero to full.

    Toyota will be creating bZ hubs to handle the ordering which will be virtual (and pickup/final sale I assume). Probably a European thing.

    And my favorite, it can ford water up to 500mm (page 3). That’s higher than the 18” wheel that come standard (about 19.7 inches and it’s about 30% of the vehicle’s total height). I would recommend they NOT advertise that here as you know some idiot will try it. I’m assuming they meant still water.


    iPad ? Pro
     
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  11. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    There are some here who question Toyota's wide variation of approaches, despite the long-standing history of successes from limited rollouts to limited markets. This is one such example where the payoff should be obvious. In China, with the C-HR/Izoa experience of their BEV convert models (as well as iX4 and Proace), we saw the rollout of UX300e with that extremely long warranty. Those naysayers argued the wisdom from getting real-world feedback from an vehicle clearly not designed exclusively for EV drive. It was well received. Whether or not the vehicle sold well was beside the point. In fact, there was an expectation of it being more of an exclusive... an intentional rarity, something Toyota delivers from time to time.

    Anywho, that warranty is an aspect of "price" many completely overlook. Both antagonists and supporters simply don't address the topic. Toyota is helping move the industry along, pushing from a vantage point that brings them from supposed "laggard" to an automaker demonstrating leadership to reach the masses. Squeezing batteries into an expensive niche isn't their game. That party isn't one Toyota wanted to attend. Their effort is to appeal to ordinary consumers.

    Think about what most people are concerned about. Sure, there is range-anxiety, but everyone knows charging-station availability will grow. That expansion will happen regardless of their participation. Such a lengthy warranty not only directly addresses their concern about battery replacement, it also stirs interest. It brings about curiosity of just how far the EV technology they always heard was coming has actually progressed.

    In other words, the juggernaut is on the move. We have been witnessing what happens when the "Tortoise & Hare" story plays out in the real world.
     
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  12. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Just like the coverage in China, you must bring in the vehicle annually for a checkup. That data will be priceless for Toyota. They will be able to collect real-world detail you will gladly exchange for longevity assurance. It is an intriguing means of keeping dealerships (at least here in the United States) part of the ownership experience too. They will have service for BEV provide in place of some lost ICE service. As long as you are there anyway, why not have your tires rotated & replaced at the same time?
     
  13. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    This was like reading sales literature
    The shotgun approach - see what sticks. Why damn GM for doing this, (thinking 1st Gen Cadillac Escalade that simply gets a badge on an existing Chevy model) saying it shows they have no direction, then tout that approach when Toyota does it.
    other manufacturers already did that, decades ago. Disney must have had a dozen S10 electric pickups that were essentially the guts of the ev1 with a S10 body.
    China told Toyota, "either sell EVs here - or get out." Of course it was well received. It was what they were told to deliver.
    if this is to say a car price that's more expensive due to a much longer warranty? Yes - there may be SOMEone out there that didn't figure that out, possibly.
    No one doubts Toyota's ability to incorporate quality - regardless of drive train. But considering history, Ev leadership?

    1751692195.jpg

    Considering their advertisement, at what point did Toyota do an about-face - if it wasn't for China's edict / ultimatum
    Squeezing batteries into an expensive niche .... did someone forget Toyota's first Rav4 Electric?
    What percentage of the existing CCS network has Toyota paid for?
    tortoise and hare is a nice story, but most of the time, the tortoise stays in last place. It's the 1% exception compared to the 99% of the time ending. Toyota will do fine, they will catch up to all the other manufacturers despite having to be arm-twisted into moving along.

    Building an electric car is not rocket science. That's proven by the quantity of do-it-yourself folks that have already taken existing vehicles and transposed them into Electrics.
     
    #133 hill, Dec 4, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2021
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  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Generous warranties assuage fears. It is why Hyundai and Kia had those 10yr/100k mile bumper to bumper ones in the early '90s. Now, did their product become defect free with that warranty?

    With such warranties, the manufacturer either has a product that good, or they budget the cost of warranty repairs. With Toyota, it is likely the former. Plus, a majority of Teslas have gone 100k miles with capacity loss under 10%. If Toyota's warranty becomes a factor in driving sales, they others will soon follow with their own.
     
  15. Aegean

    Aegean Active Member

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    As far as warranty nothing beats the lifetime traction battery warranty on the 2019 Kia Niro Electric with no annual inspections. However, the same 2019 Kia Niro electric is on the worst used car list of the September 2021 Consumer reports used car annual edition!
     
  16. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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    Didn't the industry leader(s) figure out about 10 years ago that the future was to do this over-the-air so as not to waste the customer's time? Looks like they will still have to wait to be liberated from the dealership "experience". :D
     
  17. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Physical inspections can not be performed over-the-air.
     
  18. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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    Cause you just gotta touch the battery to get all that important telemetry.

    We have had 2 Leafs now. There was nothing they needed to see on their inspections. But understand, Toyota is ahead of everyone on touching the battery.
     
  19. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Leaf was a sealed system, no vents or fluids.
     
  20. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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    No, you're totally right, Toyota is way ahead by doing this. :D
     
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