Featured Toyota Chasing Tesla Styling With 2nd Generation 2021 Mirai Fuel Cell Vehicle

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by Danny, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    I didn’t buy it as a collectors item, I bought it as a device that I could use to transport myself to places.
    It also served as a tool to help educate people about what could be done with electric cars.

    I bought the stock as a long term commitment ;)
     
  2. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    How quaint! That is like buying an iPhone to make phone calls!

    Here, vehicles are expected to be entertainment devices, like cell phones only larger.
     
  3. kenmce

    kenmce High Voltage Member

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    So they have this nice sexy beast of a car, but there is nowhere in my state I can fill it up. Usually I don't spend $50k (US) on lawn ornaments...
     
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  4. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    I thought all states were part of the electrical power grid. o_Oo_O

    In fact, when I was younger, I remember a large power outage that wreaked havoc in New York City. I was in Toronto Canada at the time & experienced it too.
     
  5. kenmce

    kenmce High Voltage Member

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    Hydrogen. Hydrogen. I do fine with things take AC but not so much with Hydrogen. I'm told there is a Hydrogen beamer running around somewhere in the NYC metro area, so if I could find him, and he would talk to a Toyota owner, maybe there's this one place...?
     
  6. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    With those words I see that you are far from be a car guy! This explains a lot and it maybe it’s true for more than just you on the Tesla band wagon.
     
  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Seriously?o_O You'd take the car with less usable range than most standard gas cars, that would have less further range for you as the refueling station is out of your way, than the car you refuel at home? Or are you posting here with a methanol powered laptop with cellular service?
    How are hydrogen, or any, FCEVs going to appeal to car guys? Has there been any high performance FCEV?
     
  8. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Who’s making you buy one?

    As far as I know Hydrogen stations are just starting to open in the Tri-State area.

    Perfect example of not being a car guy!

    Less useable range then standard cars? I didn’t know that 300 miles was considered less! It Is certainly more than enough for the average person on a daily basis. Again with the fueling stations out of the way, then don’t buy one if you don’t have the fueling stations in your area. Wait on the infrastructure to be built out. Pretty simple.

    Yet here we are at the end of 2020 and we have Toyota, Honda and Hyundai all expanding the fuel cell market in the USA, China, Germany and other European markets. Not to mention trucking manufacturers USA and European all interested and investing into Hydrogen.
     
    #168 orenji, Oct 17, 2020
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  9. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    October 8, 2020

    In commemoration of National Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Day, the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) officially launched the Million Mile Fuel Cell Truck (M2FCT) and the H2NEW consortia to advance fuel cell truck and hydrogen production R&D. Today’s announcement builds upon DOE’s Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy Office’s (EERE’s) intention to invest up to $100 million over five years, subject to appropriations, to reduce the cost of fuel cells for trucks and of electrolyzers for hydrogen production.
     
  10. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    There is one in Conneticut, which I believed opened a few years back. There were others that have closed.

    Oh. I used to want a Porsche, or a classic Corvette, a '57. I did some tinkering on my Dad's sixties Mustangs. I get the appeal of the power and noise. The V6 in the Sable was more fun on the power front than the little turbo in the Sonic, but I always preferred nimbleness over straight acceleration.

    Beauty is subjective. So what does the Mirai offer a car guy over a Tesla? rarity alone isn't enougj as that also attracts those simply looking for an investment. People did that with the Roadster. Never drove them, stuck them in a storage shed, and the battery bricked.

    My Sonic got over 400 miles. The Camry can reach 500. My gen2 Prius could do 600 without much effort. Today's Camry official ranges are; V6, 411; 4cyl., 537; and hybrid, 686. Cars with tiny tanks and ranges less than 300 miles are the exception.

    A BEV with 100 miles of range is enough many people's daily use, and it doesn't need you to take time out of a day to stop at a station to refuel. Plenty of posts here of people being happy not stopping for gas as often once they got their Prius.

    Offering just one car model, two which are sedans, isn't exactly expanding the market. Daimler got out of hydrogen cars, and is doing just commercial trucks. Same with VW. Nikola is looking more and more like a fraud.

    Then whe
    The hydrogen lobby group wanted over $2 billion. Guess we know who they want to pay for it.
     
  11. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    A true car guy appreciates all brands and models of cars like Jay Leno. True car guy see the imagination of the designers and engineers in each car. Cars create passion and freedom for the buyers. Who would think that a Prius could offer this when they first came out. There are more Performance parts for a Prius than for some much faster vehicles. At this time with only few thousand Mirai and newless of the vehicle there are not many parts, but Tein and SRS make coilovers, there are body kits for it and of course larger and wider wheels.

    To get 600 miles in Prius you must drive extremely slow. 300 miles is more then acceptable and that will last the average driver more than a few days of driving between fuel stops.
     
    #171 orenji, Oct 17, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 17, 2020
  12. kenmce

    kenmce High Voltage Member

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    Done well, Hydrogen could be fully carbon neutral. Hard to do that with a gasser.
     
  13. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    true for the rest of the world, but Japan had the Nissan Leaf out October 2010, exactly 10 years ago.
    .
     
    #173 hill, Oct 17, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
  14. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    what - you mean they don't make giant scoops, massive rear end spoilers, huge offset rims with matching fenders? How sad.

    really. What does the prime get ..... iirc their sales aren't tanking the way the regular Prius is, at least here in the US.
     
  15. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Tesla sold the Nissan Leaf 10 years ago?? If not then the person you quote4d was correct and you are confused.
     
  16. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Nice dodge.
    Since very few car guys has Leno's networth, why would they buy a Mirai over say, a Camry? TNGA has given the Camry some performance cred. It is a nice, comfortable car; not enough luxury, there is the Lexus IS and ES. Want speed, there is the V6, and the hybrid for those that want new technology in the drive train.

    Perhaps because the Prius isn't a performance car. You don't have to add anything to a Miata or Hellcat to get that. They are ready to go right out of the box, to speak.

    I though car guys appreciates all brands and models of cars. A true one wouldn't need to fix what wasn't broken.

    I loved my Prius, and even looked into eco mods for it, but i wouldn't try to make it something it ain't.
    I was getting 58 to 60 mpg on my commute.The speeds of 35 to 55 mph were not slow for the roads or traffic.

    I would get sick of having to fill up every few days with regular driving. many here have cited not having to get gasoline as often as a perk for getting a hybrid like the Prius. The hydrogen crowd pushes that the public will accept it easier because it is just like what they are use to, but much of that public are happy when they has to fuel up less often, or not at all.

    Plants that make renewable hydrogen can be the first step of plants that make renewable methanol and methane. Both of those can fuel a gasser. With more energy put in, the process can yield a synthetic crude that can be refined into gasoline that today's cars and stations can use without modification. Taking less energy, adapting the fleet and infrastructure to methanol or methane would be better going forward though, and solid oxide fuel cells can run on them without a reformer.

    As for hydrogen, we are looking at another ten years before renewable can equal the cost of natural gas sourced. Then building out the infrastructure will cost more than any other alternate fuel option.

    BMW's last hydrogen car available was bi-fuel. If one is running around you, it likely is just using gasoline. In a FSP V12 that got 5 miles to a gallon when it did have liquid hydrogen in the tank.

    I'm sure all the rims for the Camry will fit the Mirai.
    How will it do without the subsidies, is the question. Part of the Prius tanking is that people are getting Primes for less.
     
  17. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    - speed reading incorrectly - i thought Zythryn was saying only Tesla was marketed 10yrs ago. good catch
    i could edit the above - but then your response would look nutty - & it's best only i look that way.
    :oops:
    .
     
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  18. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    Where did you get that idea?

    Driving cross country at high speed on interstates with lots of wind I averaged 56mpg which gives me over 600 miles on 11.3 gallons plus the EV range. In town I can average over 70mpg on gas only for nearly 800 miles of range.
     
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  19. t_newt

    t_newt Active Member

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    I never knew there was ever a production car that took liquid hydrogen as a fuel. Fascinating! I always wondered if liquid hydrogen would work, but the Wikipedia page mentions some of the shortcomings, at least for cars:
    When not using fuel, the Hydrogen 7’s hydrogen tank starts to warm and the hydrogen starts to vaporize. Once the tank’s internal pressure reaches 87 psi, at roughly 17 hours of non-use, the tank will safely vent the building pressure. Over 10–12 days, it will completely lose the contents of the tank because of this.​
     
  20. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Did I say Prius or Prime? o_O
     
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