Featured Toyota Prius sales have tanked, 4 reasons why

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by Ashlem, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. GasperG

    GasperG Active Member

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    You are not so off the mark with higher power hybrids:
    ...
    The concept has been designed around the use of a new hybrid powertrain that offers more power and performance than the 122 DIN hp system featured in the current production Toyota C-HR. This reflects a significant and strategic future development of Toyota’s world-leading technology that will higher performance hybrid options being made available in all its core models. More details regarding this expansion of hybrid will be revealed early in 2018.
    ...
    TOYOTA C-HR Hy-Power CONCEPT   
     
  2. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    Oh yeah, I forgot about that thing.
     
  3. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    I suspect a GTI competitor or Si competitor would suffice; no need to go full blown. It would still be significantly cheaper than the Supra.

    Do you think a dual Otto-Atkinson cycle engine would be a reasonably cheaper solution for a slight power bump? I'm guessing around 150hp?
     
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  4. Beachbummm

    Beachbummm Senior Member

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    reason 1 and 2 are why ill never buy another hybrid plus the cost of repairs and limited places outside the dealer that works on them.. plus the build quiality is gone.. put more repairs into my 08 then my 05 with half the miles
     
  5. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    You are buying cars near the end of their designed age and dissing build quality. We know that you have decided against another hybrid but many here have had different experiences. Welcome to my ignore list.
     
  6. RCO

    RCO Senior Member

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    Ouch! That's a bit severe imho, but you know best.:cautious:
     
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  7. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    He bought an old car and installed a used battery module as a cheap fix. Now the car is starting to need repairs due to age but Toyota’s build quality gets blamed.
     
  8. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    That certainly wouldn't hurt, although efficiency would be hurt. I'd say to go for more displacement before going to VVT-iW or VVT-iE, really.

    Worth noting that there's a 2.0 liter 3ZR-FXE rumored for the upcoming UX 250h, and that would likely give a similar power bump, too.

    (That said, it's worth noting that some of the gains from Toyota's Otto-cycle engines are from higher RPM, which due to the nature of the power split devices, only helps at very high vehicle speeds. Even a stock Gen 4 only reaches peak power at 88 mph, after all. Gains from more low-end torque will help everywhere, though, if the transmission can handle the increased electrical path power (or, paradoxically, if the engine has to throttle back due to MG1/MG2/battery power limits, lowering engine RPM at a given speed can increase total power to the wheels, by reducing electrical path power percentage).)

    At the same time, though, I think a bump to 140-150 hp isn't really going to get many people to buy a Prius that wouldn't otherwise. A bump to 208 hp? Now that could be something interesting, because that is into hot hatch territory.
     
  9. Stevevee

    Stevevee Active Member

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    As much as I used to love driving cars, it's not a high priority now. Maybe Toyota has just taken those fond memories out of me. Sure, gas prices are lower than expected, lots of newer competition, and many ICE vehicles get really good mileage, most of which cost less. As time goes by, every time I see a new Prius, I want to look away. Combined with the front grills of all Toyotas, it's like some evil, bug-eating virus has gotten into Toyota's design systems to create these oversized bug-catching grills.

    Toyota also makes strange decisions at times, like coming out with a newly-designed Camry, with two different batteries in the hybrid version. One gets fantastic mileage but doesn't have the features you want, the other has what you want, but mileage goes way down. Also, the used-to-be free integrated navigation is a bug, not a feature.

    They are coming out with an all-new Prius v this year. Thankfully, they did away with the bubble roof design and appear to have made the car more suv-like with flatter roof. God only knows what battery that will have in it. At least from the rear, the Prius Prime looks better from what I've seen. it's also a 4-seater.

    Prius sales are down because a lot of people don't want to drive, a Prius. The new one definitely drives better than the old one, and I can personally give it a big, Not Bad. But many won't look at a Prius because they simply don't want to look at it. There are a lot of hybrids coming out nowadays, both tradition hybrids and plugins. Most of them are more visually appealing for sure.

    I don't expect this to change because Toyota has a long history of digging their heels in. Other carmakers are ramping up and doing it quickly. Since we've cut down our mileage quite bit in recent years, our gas budget isn't even a line item anymore. So when I compare the prices at the same trim levels, the hybrid still loses by quite a bit, payback is somewhere around year 15. Another drawback for Toyota is that we'd probably not look at other hybrid makes, but we would with ICE cars.
     
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  10. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    The devil is in the detail.

    Who is doing what?
     
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  11. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    I agree with you. One reason I chose the Gen 4 Prius is the lack of that large black grille. Whatever infected the design, I think the Lexus designers have a worse case of it

    They current rumor is the US & Puerto Rico will not see this model though. :(
     
  12. Stevevee

    Stevevee Active Member

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    Well there's lot of brands for sure. Nissan, Honda, Ford, now Subaru this year with Prime parts.

    But the sales are still pretty low. The advantage IMO, is that there are choices, and the vast majority of cars are more appealing. Looking at hybrid sales, it's clear that Toyota never got that memo about selling to the masses. They did finally get the message on electrics though, but it got lost in the mail. I suspect some mad hydrogen proponent destroyed the letter, but the investigation is still ongoing.

    Yes, the devil is in the detail. So far, Toyota still has the best system.
     
  13. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Worldwide rollout of Prime all in a single year along with 51,000 sales doesn't count?

    This year they're ramping up Prime production, rolling out the new hybrid, and introducing an EV in China.

    What got lost ?
     
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  14. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Huh?

    RAV4 hybrid sales were strong right from the start and it remains that way.

    Camry hybrid looks to hold similar potential.

    C-HR & Yaris hybrid sales are strong in Europe.
     
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  15. telmo744

    telmo744 HSD fanatic

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  16. telmo744

    telmo744 HSD fanatic

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    Agree, totally.

    Do you have a link/source to the 3ZR-FXE rumours?
     
  17. RCO

    RCO Senior Member

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    My grandmother used to say, "You don't judge a sausage by its skin"!
     
  18. Stevevee

    Stevevee Active Member

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    To a certain extent that's true. My car is fugly, but I don't hate it ;) But Toyota seems to go out of their way sometimes. They figure if they can't make you hate the looks, then they'll screw with you with Entune.
     
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  19. Stevevee

    Stevevee Active Member

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    The Rav4 hybrid is a better attraction for most because it is a good-selling vehicle anyway, and the hybrid is an SUV with decent mileage. The new Camry is better in most every way than the old one, and is nice looking except for the polarizing front end.

    In Europe, the gas prices give the hybrids that much more appeal.
     
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  20. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    I'm not sure why so many complain about Entune, etc... Sure, it's not great. However, don't most of us use out phones nowadays? I have everything I need on my phone, and I can take it from vehicle to vehicle. All I need is a bluetooth connection...and I'm good. (y)
     
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