Featured Toyota's Anti-Electric Car Marketing Scam Gets Banned In Norway

So you are interested only in the direct cost savings of fuel for EVs?

Here you go:

Assumption: a 30 mpg car in CA where gas cost $3.00 - 3.50 per gallon and electricity costs $0.20 to $0.24 per kwh or as low $0.10 if you have solar

Gas cost per mile:
$3.00 to go 30 miles is ($3.00/gal) / (30 miles/gal) = $0.10 per mile
$3.50 would be $0.117 per mile

EV cost per mile:
The Tesla model 3 get about 4 miles per kwh.
($.20 /kwh) / (4 miles/ kwh) = $0.05 per mile
$0.24/kwh would be $0.06 per mile

Seems to me EVs are cheaper to fuel in CA...but plug in your own numbers and tell me what you get.
Yes a Prius gets higher mpg...but its not in the same class as a Model 3. But at best it is about the same as a Tesla M3.

You "can" also have solar and fuel a Tesla for $0.025 per mile. You can't make your own gas.
If some parts of the country gas is only about $2.00/gal, but then electricity is only $0.10/kwh in many places too.

There are numerous advantages to reducing oil usage:
- air quality in cities (EVs move any pollution outside the areas where most people breathe)
- reduce oil imports, electricity is domestic, reduce funding of OPEC
- lower CO2 per mile even if coal generates a large part of your grid
- As EVs age they get cleaner as the grid gets cleaner
- ICE cars NEVER get cleaner as they age...they generally get dirtier

Mike

 

wow - got some ruffled feathers here. Well let's get this over with.

Not even going to reply to this ridiculousness.

I've NEVER heard of a RAV4 Hybrid or Hybrid Camry. Holy Crap is that a Corolla Hybrid? Really Hill....? In all the time I've been at PC, I considered you to be one of the more highly regarded users of this place. But saying Hybrid sales have decreased? Yes for the Prius.... But not everyone wants one. I mean have you seen the crap they did to the Prius? Ugliest car ever. lol (well, next to that Truck thing Tesla wants to do)

We actually have quite a bit of wind generated electricity here. Take a ride north like your going to Chicago and those windmills are everywhere. According to wiki, if it's accurate, Indiana ranks 12th in wind generated electricity. BUT you don't get to pick your power here. There are literally 2 coal plants within 100 miles of me.

Prius hasn't had belts in awhile now.

Nah, not really. I don't drive an EV. But if I "Had" to purchase one, it would be pretty crappy to have to pay more that much I can tell you lol Like I said though, just going from what I was told.

 

Toyota To Sell 500,000 EVs In 2025, Only 10,000 In 2020

 

maybe you never caught Toyota's ad campaign, below - but they ran them on every continent.
Seriously - one would thinktl they would have pulled Those ads down after getting bashed over the veracity issue. But I guess maybe that's still their tagline? It is kind of an unconscious way to promote the way-too broad a notion that you don't need an EV.

 

I certainly wouldn't advertise a type of car I wasn't selling. Corporations are guilty of so much worse crimes. This seems like a distraction.

 

Rooftop solar comment was meant to be tongue & cheek and not meant in a nasty fashion, because often solar can be less costly than Coal, not even considering the coal ash cleanup. Even considering the @eldrobro link in the post above (hybrid sales likely to wane), Toyota hybridizing more models has cannibalized Prius sales & that's what I was referring to.
.

 

The difference is, those 4 ICE parts are made of iron, steel and aluminum while EVs have hundreds or thousands of parts made of lithium, manganese and cobalt. That's why ICE cars are still so much cheaper than EVs.

And the reason for the huge range difference is that the ICE+gas tank is 1,000Wh/kg while those expensive (and not easily recyclable) EV parts are 250Wh/kg.

 

Please don't "speculate" as to what you THINK I would say.

So far you have described Toyota's Hybrid advertising campaign using the terms....LIE, SCAM and now DEMENTED?

Yes, I think it's all ridiculous.

To frame Toyota's advertising using those terms, to me reveals a limited understanding of advertising itself. Toyota's trying to sell Hybrids. They are trying to reach an audience that may be comparing EV's to Hybrids. So is it such a Scam or Lie to point out Hybrids don't have to be plugged in? Is that a lie? Is that a scam?

I haven't heard NOR have links to the actual advertising been provided, so I don't know about the claims of "unlimited range". But it isn't a stretch to say everyone on planet earth should understand NO VEHICLE has unlimited range. Regardless of any advertising slogan or catch phrase, or statement, I think everyone knows whether it's one tank of gasoline or one charge..there is a range to anything that uses created energy to move you.
So it would seem clear to me that when Toyota say's that their Hybrid has unlimited range, they are talking about being able to refuel, and continue to drive, without worrying about the battery charge, and having to stop and plug in.
If it's "advertising disingenious" it's ONLY so, because it fails to point out that a full EV also has an unlimited range if you can stop and recharge.
Anyway, LIE, SCAM,....LOL! DEMENTED...NO...it's called Advertising. Toyota sells a perfectly honest product with their Hybrids.

 

Prius and Prius Prime have, and have always had gears, just not as many as a conventional car. Tesla's have gearboxes too.

 

[QUOTE="And the reason for the huge range difference is that the ICE+gas tank is 1,000Wh/kg while those expensive (and not easily recyclable) EV parts are 250Wh/kg.[/QUOTE]

I have no reason to doubt your power to weight claim but on the huge range difference I am not so sure. A typical (non hybrid) car gets 300-400 miles to a tank, an typical EV gets 220-310 this year so that is pretty close, at least I don't call that a huge range difference perhaps you do. The more important difference is availability of charging vs gas stations particularly on road trips. EVs have lower fuel costs, and depending on where you live it may be almost nothing like in my case (solar, free charging at work l2, free charging at various places around town). No oil changes, less maintenence just hit with that battery eventually just as our prius does but of course the prius has a cheaper battery than an EV.

On gears are you meaning transmissions? Yes the Prius has a CVT. The Tesla has a single speed reduction gearbox with a fixed ratio so I guess depending on your viewpoint that may be a gear. Nissan claims their leaf has no transmission, it may be similar to the Tesla.

 

I have no reason to doubt your power to weight claim but on the huge range difference I am not so sure. A typical (non hybrid) car gets 300-400 miles to a tank, an typical EV gets 220-310 this year so that is pretty close, at least I don't call that a huge range difference perhaps you do. [/quote]

The last car I had with a range under 300 miles was manufactured in 1972. Every car I've had manufactured after 1980 has had a range over 425 miles.

A Prius has an eCVT - no belts and the gears are in constant mesh with no ratio changes possible.

Its a gear by definition.

No "transmission" doesn't mean no gears. They have gears. I know of a single EV prototype with no gears (4 direct-drive wheel motors).

 

Rivian perhaps? Direct drive could happen with one engine to one wheel, remember when cars had a single rear wheel that spun? Or two motors on two wheels (pick two rear or two front). Basically you don't have to have 4 motors, of course all wheel drive is awesome and can allow things like tank turns with four motors.

 

Home | The electric car that charges itself with sunlight | Lightyear

 

Toyota named to World's most Admired Company list
Toyota Named to Fortune Magazine's 2019 'World's Most Admired' list - Toyota USA Newsroom

Toyota's Social and Humanitarian contributions
Social Contribution Activities | ESG (Environment, Social, Governance) Activities | Sustainability | Toyota Motor Corporation Official Global Website

Toyota becomes Global Special Olypics partener
Toyota Signs Agreement to Become Global Partner of Special Olympics

Toyota earns Top Diversity Employer
Toyota Kentucky -|- The Official Website of TMMK

Toyota Community giving
Community Giving - Toyota USA Newsroom

Toyota 4Good Program
Toyota USA | Supporting Our Communities

Toyota Volunteer in Place Program for emplyees to volunteer in their communities
Toyota Kentucky -|- The Official Website of TMMK

In their Georgetown Kentucky Plant Toyota employees a number of special needs individuals who build up dashes to be installed in vehicles on the main line. Special needs employees are paid full salary and treated as full Team Members. This contributes to their feeling of self respect and dignity. All their work does go through a special inspection before it goes to the main line for installation. Toyota does not promote or draw attention to this program nor the thousands of other community good deeds they and their employees do each day!

I could go on for days but if someone doesn't get the point by now they just don't want to.

 

I called batteries "parts", made of lithium, manganese and cobalt (among others).

No, they're cheaper because they're made of iron, steel and aluminum, instead of lithium, manganese and cobalt, and because they are using much less of those materials (because they are lighter).

 

*deleted* - early morning ramble, and I'm a grump in the morning...