Valvoline MaxLife Full Synthetic ATF - Instead of Toyota WS

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by ski.dive, Apr 23, 2019.

  1. jzchen

    jzchen Senior Member

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    Fundamentally incompatible should fail, and quite quickly, but it isn’t, just like “Lifetime” fluid should be checked, and isn’t. So we listen to Toyota, when we want to.....
     
  2. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Titanic Social Director

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    Exactly, And I lose no sleep doing that, lol. Changing a fluid, with the same fluid, following the Repair Manual instruction, seems a good bet. But to go to an alternate fluid, in the face of emphatic warnings, I'm not going to risk that.
     
  3. jzchen

    jzchen Senior Member

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    Saying that fluid can’t be improved upon, is turning a blind eye to progress. Which came first, WS, or the Prius, or did they come out at the same time?

    Toyota wants to say if you don’t use Toyota branded WS, you will lose your warranty, but can’t due to Magnusson-Moss Warranty Act here in the US. They must provide WS free in order to require use of a specific product to keep your warranty. People say that you can be denied warranty coverage if you use a different fluid. Your transmission may fail because it might be incompatible. These are both “convoluted” as well. The US law states that Toyota is to prove how your supposedly “compatible” fluid caused the failure, then deny warranty coverage. The fluid may also be enhanced, to improve upon the original WS formulation.

    In this case after the Toyota warranty is up, Valvoline will warrant the transmission. I think that’s more to my liking.....
     
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  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Titanic Social Director

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  5. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    Toyota "branded" WS fluid is used in most of their ATF applications...and is not Prius CVT specfic. While I fully agree in principle and practice with Mendel on this one, it is not the only option. Just be very careful what SPEC you use as a substitute...and why.

    The real key here is to just change it regulaly. ;)
     
  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Titanic Social Director

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    I checked 2019 Corolla Owner's Manual, not used there. It is used on 2019 4Runner, and has the warning not to sub, saying it could damage the transmission.
     
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  7. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    My two cents...I'd much rather stick with what Toyota recommends rather than save a few bucks. Heck, Toyota even stands by their WS fluid as a 'lifetime' product ( but of course we all know better ). (y) Plus, oodles of folks here have used Toyota WS without issue....why take the chance at an alternative?

    With that being said....there will always be people that yearn to find something 'better' ( yes, I'm guilty )...regardless of what it is.

    So if you want to 'experiment' then use the alternative if you must...but could you please note that when you sell the car? I'm sure the buyer would want to know that. (y) I certainly would!
     
    #67 farmecologist, Apr 26, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2019
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  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Titanic Social Director

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    Yeah, I've been trying to inflammatory statements, but this is one reason I've always bought new.
     
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  9. jzchen

    jzchen Senior Member

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    I’ll stick the receipts from the Valvoline change place in the glove box before I die. It’s gonna be 6 years old this end of May, with currently less than 25k miles, IF I don’t find any issue and already report that here, AND switch back to Toyota WS with a new tranny, meaning the tranny never saw anything but Toyota WS....
     
  10. jzchen

    jzchen Senior Member

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    Called the Valvoline place in Pasadena, (because the one nearer here in Temple City does not reference Arcadia in their service area, but Alhambra twice)? $169.99, fluid is “Max-Life ATF”. All the legal mumbo jumbo I read before. I believe they require every 30k miles to keep the lifetime warranty in effect. Got a little over 5k miles to go.

    I did notice that WS change interval has been noted by Toyota it seems. Whereas originally they noted it is a lifetime fluid with normal use....
     
  11. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    First rule of oil threads is that there are never any winners. It's more about the scrum than the outcome.
     
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  12. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    They should rename the 'politics and religion' board 'oil and religion'. I'll leave it at that. :whistle:
     
  13. Skibob

    Skibob Senior Member

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    You mean your ok with not saving 4 cents per 100 miles by using Valvoline over Toyota WS?
     
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  14. ski.dive

    ski.dive Active Member

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    Skibob said:

    The OP is in my opinion a troll. He just talks crazy stuff to rile people up. I honestly wonder if he really owns a Prius or just comes here to stir it up. Either way the guy is a clown.
    if the guy was It would not surprise me banned here before. Perhaps the mods should check his MAC and IP address-quote


    Skibob---
    Who the ''HELL'' do you think you are...Making
    'Insinuating Statements' about people on this page?

    My original post was to show- that there is an alternative to Toyota ATF WS...What is wrong with that?


    Calling people a ''CLOWN and a TROLL'' saying that I just talk crazy stuff to rile people up and then asking if I really own a Prius and that I just come here to stir it up.

    ***The Moderators of this site, need to take a good look at your ''attitude issues'' with fellow members.


    Again Skibob:
    My original post was to show
    , that there is an alternative to Toyota ATF WS...What is wrong with that?
     
  15. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Titanic Social Director

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    I kinda agree, to call someone a troll for asking about an alternate fluid is over the top. Still, maybe time we all disperse, lol? One of those "that escalated quickly" scenarios?
     
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  16. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    Tone is often pretty important in communication.
    The insistence of absolutes in what is opinion, being advanced as known fact, is what I think riles people up.

    Everyone is free to do whatever they want with their vehicle, use whatever maintenance approach they wish to use. BUT....

    A practice counter to Toyota's own owners manual recommendation and warning, being presented as irrefutable fact because

    " My neighbor has been using Valvoline MaxLife 100% Full Synthetic ATF
    - Instead of Toyota non synthetic WS on his TOYOTA for over 5 years=NO ISSUES. "



    All presented in bold face type....with the ultimate statement as fact....

    " Valvoline MaxLife Full Synthetic ATF is compatible with Toyota WS. "

    Is what I think comes off as being troll (ish).

    Since this really is all opinion....not tested or known fact....sorry your neighbors 5 years usage is NOT scientific, you should expect that some people are going to disagree with your opinion.

    Personally?
    With my vehicle, I'm probably dealing with the single most expensive thing I own. Whether a fluid is compatible or not? Any minimal savings is not worth going against manufacturers recommendation .
    I think I trust Toyota slightly more than somebodies neighbor.

    BUT...
    Free to do what you wish.
     
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  17. jzchen

    jzchen Senior Member

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    WS was developed in 2002. It is now 17 years later. Whatever patent Toyota may have had on it I’m guessing should be up for a while now, meaning other ATF manufactures can start making “generics” as is used in the pharmacy world. 17 years is a long time for a fluid spec in my opinion. I believe that when a “reputable” manufacturer develops an alternative, researches suitability, confirms the application in question as there is a concern about T-IV and WS not being compatible, and then goes on to back it’s product when professionally changed, that it is an educated choice/calculated risk taken to use the product.

    Misinterpretation/Misrepresentation in a single post should not be condemned. In particular when the poster comes back and states that what he’s going to do, and clarifies “do what you like”, that he is just sharing. Jumping on his back is uncalled for. This is just that, sharing. If something bad happens, it is enough to warn him of our concerns. He did not need to come and share what he is doing, and has no obligation to come back and say, if it turns out bad, to warn us, or if he is happy, to tell us conversely of that. Of course if treated poorly he’d be less likely to come back with what he finds. So who loses, we all lose this information. I notice danlatu is not updating us with how his use of the same MaxLife is going as an example.

    I am the person who is using the Chinese LiFePO4 12 V battery. I really chose my words carefully as to not rile up a storm on that thread, where I said I was in love with it. If I didn’t, I may have been soured towards the idea of coming back and updating on how it’s been working out for me. (So far no issues).....
     
    #77 jzchen, Apr 27, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2019
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  18. Skibob

    Skibob Senior Member

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    Honestly use whatever you want. No Gen 2 has any warranty left. Best of luck.
     
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  19. jzchen

    jzchen Senior Member

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    I often get mixed up where I am exactly on this forum, when on my phone, and did not realize this is in the Gen 2 section. My apologies for any confusion this may have caused.

    What I did make a mistake on was that Valvoline requires changing the transmission fluid every 30k miles through a professional, to keep the $4k warranty in effect. Reading portions of the lengthy terms again, first service needs to be done by the 50,000 mi milestone for the $4k warranty. $2k coverage applies if your first service is between 50,001 miles and 100k miles, $1k coverage if first service is done between 100,001 mi and 125k mi, and $500 coverage if first service is between 125,001 and 150k miles. It notes lifetime maximum meaning once you are given that amount as an upper limit, their obligation to cover you is finished I guess. The terms make no mention of “In Service Date” or any reference to time between services for that matter, just the odometer mileage. So just as long as the mileage is 150,000 mi or under when having the first service done qualifies for some level of coverage, that and service every 30,500 mi thereafter. For your reference here’s the document:

    https://p.widencdn.net/kxxbsr/US-VPS-0059-EN_VPS_SERVICE_PLUS_PROGRAM_SHEET

    (Hoping I did not make any mistake in my interpetation)!
     
    #79 jzchen, Apr 28, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2019
  20. AVS1

    AVS1 New Member

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    I grappled with the same question as OP. I looked at it not from a cost standpoint but rather availability. Nobody sells the Toyota stuff except for Toyota and they are not nearby. Amazon yes, but people said that it may be counterfeit.

    That said... enough people saying only use OEM so that is what I’m using.
     
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