VW Faces $17B Fine for Emissions Scam

Discussion in 'Environmental Discussion' started by Jeff N, Sep 18, 2015.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    A slow night, I revisited the old "Portland-to-Portland" site: Steenman: Portland Green Test Drive. What we did and why we did it. | Steenman Associates

    I had forgotten my 2009 posting that the legal diesel limits were so lax:

    Recently we had a Jetta TDI advocate restart an old thread "2009 VW Jetta TDI Emissions Results In!" over at PriusChat.
    . . .
    We found the TDI vehicles have at least 9 times the emissions per mile than the 2010 Prius. Apparently the diesels have larger, allowable emissions standards to meet than the Prius. The fine relates to some diagnostic capability that is needed.

    So if the Jetta TDI is "clean," then the 2010 Prius must seem "immaculate."

    We also checked with the EPA web site for user reported mileage:

    Jetta TDI :: 2010 Prius
    40.0 MPG (27 vehicles) :: 50.3 MPG (64 vehicles)

    The results seem instructive.

    Even the legal versions back then were not worthy of the claimed "Clean Diesel."

    Bob Wilson
     
  2. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    You guys sound like the Trucker Forums beating up the Prius. Post #822 :ROFLMAO:
     
  3. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Call me thick, but I don't get how truckers lambasting/hating pri' equates to Volkswagen discussion of fraud/conspiracy/respiratory deaths increasing.
     
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  4. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    This sums it up



    do not know who he is other than some excitable Aussie, but he's pretty much spot on. Worth a watch all the way through, though beware of his language in parts.
     
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    An Aussi is a Yankee without the self control.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #825 bwilson4web, Nov 8, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2015
  6. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Isn't that a very low bar?
     
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  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i was content with yankee.
     
  8. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    #828 bwilson4web, Nov 9, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2015
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  9. DeadPhish

    DeadPhish Senior Member

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  10. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Reign of terror - "you vill make it verk unt you vill like it" . It is a titillating story . Still it's hard to know if it's true - after all it was Bob Lutz that said it happened. His credibility is right down there with VW.
    .
     
  11. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Ordinarily I would agree but Bob Lutz was Swiss. I suspect he may have an insight in this case . . . perhaps because he did the same with GM's hybrid efforts. In particular, helping to kill the EV1, the 'two mode' fiasco, and requiring the magic word "hybrid" to be put in the body paint.

    Bob Wilson
     
  12. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Two-Mode was a interesting disaster. Watching the fallout afterward was quite informative too. It's how we knew Volt would be plagued with management-decision issues.
     
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  13. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Then we shouldn't be calling many gasoline cars clean either, seeing how they have the exact same standard to meet as the diesels.;) Oh, the Tahoe hybrid isn't dirtier than the diesel, but just as clean. Clean diesel is still a better phrase than clean coal. At least it has the potential to be as clean as most ICE gasoline cars.

    A bin 5 Prius would have better fuel economy, but then it couldn't have gotten all those HOV stickers in California.
     
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Source: Source: VW to offer gift cards to diesel owners

    Detroit — Volkswagen, in an effort to appease owners of small diesel-powered cars involved in an emissions cheating scandal, is offering them $1,000 in gift cards and vouchers, the company said.

    The offer announced Monday is a gesture of goodwill to 482,000 owners of cars whose 2-liter four-cylinder diesel engines have been implicated in the growing scandal, the company said. It also includes free roadside assistance for the diesel vehicles for three years.

    The offer is designed to keep diesel owners happy as VW works on repairs to the cars, which are programmed to turn on pollution controls during government tests and turn them off while on the road. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency says the cars emit 10 to 40 times the allowable amount of harmful nitrogen oxide while being driven.
    . . .

    Reminds me of a Beatles song, source: beatles lyrics can't buy me love - Google Search

    Can't buy me love, love
    Can't buy me love

    I'll buy you a diamond ring my friend
    If it makes you feel all right
    I'll get you anything my friend
    If it makes you feel all right
    'Cause I don't care too much for money
    For money can't buy me love

    . . .​

    If you go to the fan-boy site 'TDI forum', it seems they really don't care about NOx as long as their rides have the street handling, fuel consumption, and noise they like. I suspect they would prefer 'chipping' to support 'rolling coal' than anything else touching their ride.

    Bob Wilson
     
  15. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    $1.000 - that'll buy me a whole lot of cartridges for my respirator
    [​IMG]
    .
     
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  16. seftonm

    seftonm Member

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    Maybe the internet brings out the worst in people. But the people that I have talked to in person all felt similar to me: They bought their vehicles because of its blend of efficiency, emissions, and performance. Most have been disappointed that the car was actually only achieving two of the three criteria that they were after.
     
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  17. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Unfortunately, none of 3M's cartridges in that product line are rated to filter out VW's excess NOx emissions.

    But at least they do have several cartridges rated for the sulfur dioxide pollution from those trans-oceanic cargo ships burning high sulfur bunker oil. :)
     
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  18. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    the beatles spent a lot of time in hamburg, honing their 'craft'.;)
     
  19. godzillaismad

    godzillaismad Member

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    I suspect a large number (60% or above) wouldn't bother with the recall and be happy with driving what they have now. For those who had the recalls, they can have it turned off at GoAPR or similar workshops that tune VW based cars... Easy enough with computers.

    TDI fanboys are as thick as a croc skin, we all have to thank VW for creating such a group. They should be fined heavily for this mess.


    SM-G900I ?
     
  20. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    [​IMG]
    .
     
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