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What brakes the ICE? Calling Patrick, Bob & other experts

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Technical Discussion' started by KiwiAl, Mar 19, 2014.

  1. KiwiAl

    KiwiAl Junior Member

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    Hello Vincent,

    Many thanks for that link. Yes, I see I was a bit loose with the physics there. In fact, to avoid having the ICE rotate, MG1 would have to be precisely controlled (accelerated or decelerated as appropriate), as the vehicle speed changes, and the more rapidly the speed changes, the greater the need to drive MG1. Otherwise, the inertia of MG1 is going to present a torque reaction to the PSD, which will be reflected to the ICE crankshaft, and cause it to rotate.

    It would almost seem simpler and easier to have a brake on the ICE crankshaft, as I originally pondered. Then, one could (also) use MG1 to accelerate from low speed, and regen down to low speed. But maybe they worked out that the economics just did not justify it. But, seems to me, since you're going to have to control power to or from MG1, you might as well do a little more, and drive the car or charge the battery, and just let MG1 freewheel until the speed gets up a bit.

    I guess the argument is that the losses through the PSD are slightly higher if going that way, so it's better to waste a little electrical energy on simply keeping MG1 at the right speed (and no load on the PSD gears), than it would be to lose a (more or less fixed) percentage of the motor output power by running it through the PSD.
     
  2. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    I suspect the above post means M/G1 everywhere it says MG2 [Now fixed]
     
  3. Jason in OZ

    Jason in OZ Active Member

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    this video may help some in understanding how the transaxle works and is connected to the engine.
    note the fellow points out that there is NO solid connection from the ICE to the wheels. meaning that the ICE can only ever ASSIST MG2 to drive the wheels. the ICE alone cant power the car.

    also i note that there IS a clutch plate in there, though it's not used in the traditional sense of a clutch.
    i suspect it's used as a safety measure in case something locks up in the transaxle.



    i found the video very informative indeed.

    Jason.
     
    GrumpyCabbie and JimboPalmer like this.
  4. Greg C

    Greg C Junior Member

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    So therefore MG2 does all the regen work. So the slight jolt must be MG1 providing some torque to force the ICE to spin over 76km/hr (Gen 3 Prius). Wonderful the system undoubtedly is, one of the best things is how inherently simple it is at one level.
     
  5. vincent1449p

    vincent1449p Active Member

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    Hi Jason,

    It is actually for absorbing the torque fluctuation from engine.

    Transaxle Damper.jpg

    Vincent
     
  6. KiwiAl

    KiwiAl Junior Member

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    Correct!!! Wires crossed, for sure. Fixed for the benefit of those who follow.
     
  7. Jason in OZ

    Jason in OZ Active Member

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    thanks for the info. very informative.

    Jason