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What will it take to ignite the next American Revolution?

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by Pinto Girl, Oct 31, 2006.

  1. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

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    Pinto Girl:

    Your scenario is utopian, and therefore both beautiful and unlikely. I see two problems, one of which you acknowledge, and one of which you overlook:

    The first is human greed. people want more stuff, and they want it now. (I want a Tesla, and I want it NOW.) You've more or less said that it would take a miracle to overcome that.

    But the other problem is our economic system, which is dependent on consumerism. If people stop buying stuff, manufacturers stop producing, and lay off workers. If people stop buying services, the service companies will lay off workers. With unemployment people cannot afford the basics, and through a vicious spiral, the economy grinds to a halt.

    In a capitalist economy, there is a very delicate balance of economic factors involving savings, debt, investment, consumption, employment, inflation, etc. A severe disturbance in any one of those factors can throw the whole system out of wack and lead to a crisis, such as a depression. Your dream of people consuming less would be just such a disturbance.

    We first need to adopt an economic system which is not driven by consumption and competition. Competition is both the strength and the weakness of capitalism. Competition is what makes capitalism so powerful and so enduring, but it is also what renders it incapable of meeting the basic needs of those who are unable to compete successfully. And in any race there is one winner and a lot of losers.

    From an ecological/ conservationist point of view, it would be excellent if people cut their consumption in half. But within a capitalist society, it would lead to an economic crisis of epic proportions.
     
  2. Pinto Girl

    Pinto Girl New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Nov 4 2006, 11:21 AM) [snapback]343772[/snapback]</div>
    I agree; depending on what we stopped buying and when, it could be problematic.

    I'm still thinking in the abstract, recalling how conservationism in WWII and the Depression helped pull people together...I guess I'm just hoping we'll be a little proactive and begin thinking more about the global consequences of our decisions, instead of simply satisfying our own wants.

    Savings rates are one example. I, for one, sold a $60,000 car and paid cash for a $30,000 one. Not only is my Prius more economical to operate than a Porsche could ever dream of, but I've also put $30,000 'into play' in the stock market...

    It's this sort of consumer decision which I'm calling upon all of us to make. Don't go from an Escalade to a Smart...make a more incremental change to begin with.

    The good news is, we're wasting so much that there's *lots* of room for improvement!

    That said, I do admit that there may be a short period of discomfort, relative to the long term gains such a scheme might provide.