Which one?

Discussion in 'Newbie Forum' started by citygirl, Mar 17, 2011.

  1. citygirl

    citygirl New Member

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    Very nervous about going from my acura mdx to a prius. It seems like there is so much to "learn" with the Prius. Is that actually the case or is it simply a case of having read too many posts???
    Thanks again for all of the replies; I appreciate the help! :)
     
  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    There's not much that you have to "learn".

    If you choose to learn about mileage techniques or technical details, that's another story, but they aren't things you have to learn.
     
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  3. citygirl

    citygirl New Member

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    It seems as if the general consensus is that the navigation system is subpar. Can you get the back-up camera without the nav? The dealer I visited today didn't know.... Two words. Brain. Surgeon.:confused:
     
  4. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I have no 3rd gen but I'm generally satisfied w/the nav on my 2nd gen, other than the high price. The market was a bit different back when I got my 06 and PNDs were quite a bit more than they are now.

    But yes, there are lots of complaints about the 3rd gen's nav, I think partly because people expect more given the high price tag (for the system and updates, typically ~$200). Also, some people have been not satisfied w/the quality of the mapping data in their area.

    No, you can't get factory installed backup camera on US model 3rd gens w/o nav. :( You could on the 2nd gen. I and others have griped about this before here on PC.

    Possible options are aftermarket solutions, possibly installed by the dealer. They could involve an extra LCD or a rear view mirror containing an LCD.
     
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  5. markderail

    markderail I do 45 mins @ 3200 PSI

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    USB PLUG !!! Check that out, little things like that can tip the scale.
     
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  6. stevemcelroy

    stevemcelroy Active Member

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    If your goal is simply get in the car and drive and get over double the mpg's of your current car then there is nothing that you need to learn other than getting familiar with the controls which you would need to do with any new car. If you want to maximize your mileage then there would be some learning involved, but that is strictly something that you would need to choose.

    As for which one I would pick - while I like leather I would probably choose new over used.

    I have an 09 which has the backup camera built in - I rarely use it as I prefer looking over my shoulder. I only use the camera in very tight spaces - for example when I go into downtown Philly and need to parallel park in a tight space it is nice to have. Had it not come standard I would not have purchased it as an option.

     
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  7. citygirl

    citygirl New Member

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    So essentially all of the tips, etc that I've been reading are ways to improve the fuel efficiency - not necessarily due to quirks of the prius...?
    As always, thanks!
     
  8. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Off the top of my head, for the fuel economy portions, I'd say they fall into a bunch of categories:
    - general - applies to cars, seems as though people w/Priuses or other more efficient cars seem to pay more attention to mileage or mileage drops (esp. w/high gas prices)
    - hybrid "quirks"/behavior - not Prius specific (e.g. cold ICE running while stopped or at low speeds to provide cabin heat. The HS 250h, HyCam and NAH all do it too.)
    - Prius behavior (e.g. "super highway mode") or instruments (other hybrids have different instruments/displays)
    - Prius quirks

    There are plenty of other "tips" that having nothing to do w/fuel economy like disabling the reverse beep or setting it a single beep, BT phone support capabilities (varies a LOT depending on the phone model), 3 door vs. 1 door SKS, etc.
     
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  9. citygirl

    citygirl New Member

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    Showing my ignorance (yet again)..... I have no idea what cold ICE running to provide cabin heat means.....

    Do you like your prius? What did you drive before? Thanks for your thoughts!
     
  10. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    long reply, sorry

    Hahaha... sorry, I'm using some of the Prius lingo and I didn't want to overload you w/too much info and this gets into hybrid quirks. Some folks on here have the philosophy of "just drive it!" Others here (not me) are into figuring out speeds at which this and that are turning based on # of teeth on the gear sets, designing replacement parts, reverse engineering, etc.

    ICE=Internal Combustion Engine aka the gasoline engine

    I should've prefaced the cabin heat part w/requested cabin heat.

    I can't speak for putting the climate control aka HVAC in auto mode, since I don't use auto. Basically, when you start the Prius, the gas engine will run for awhile, to heat up the catalyst. If you have the heater on (temperature above low) and fan above OFF, in order to provide you heat, the ICE will run (or stay running) to provide you heat if the ICE is too cold.

    On a regular car, well, when the car is on, the ICE is always running and always producing waste heat. On the Prius, the ICE can (and almost always does) shutdown at low speeds or while stopped.

    On the 2nd gen Prius, if HVAC temperature == and fan is above OFF, the ICE will run, even if you're stopped if coolant temperature (FWT aka Fahrenheit Water Temperature on a ScanGaugeII - Trip Computers + Digital Gauges + Scan Tool) is or falls to <=146 F.

    Why does this matter? Shutting down the ICE when stopped or at low speeds is what helps the hybrids w/efficiency. Turning on the heat when the ICE is cold negates some of that.

    Solution to prevent the ICE from unnecessarily running to provide cabin heat? While the ICE is cold, turn the fan to OFF when stopped or in very slow traffic. Turn it back on under conditions that'd require the ICE to engage anyway (e.g. harder accelerations or speeds >=41 mph).

    Should you care or do you need to care? It depends. If you don't care about the ICE running and burning gasoline while idling when the ICE is cold, then don't screw around w/the HVAC system. You are getting 0 mpg while stopped...

    How can you tell what's the coolant temperature (FWT)? You can't w/o a tool that displays such values, such as a ScanGauge. Prius comes w/no temperature gauge. While idling, you can listen for the ICE, if it's running, you shut the HVAC fan off. The ICE should stop. When you turn the fan to on, if FWT <146 F, the ICE will start again.

    I have no 3rd gen (2010 and 2011) so I don't know its exact temperature thresholds. I hear it's 145 F (?) when in normal mode and 110 F when in eco mode. 2nd gen has no eco mode. I also hear the speed threshold might be higher (45 mph?).

    This is more than just a Prius quirk because the 2nd gen Prius, 3rd gen Prius, Lexus HS 250h, Camry Hybrid and Nissan Altima Hybrid have the same behavior. I've verified this myself. I don't know their speed and temp thresholds, only mine.

    Sorry for my long winded post... I wish I were better at writing succinctly.

    Yes, I like my Prius. It replaced my former 02 Nissan Maxima. I still have a 350Z though...

    I hate driving my Z and non-hybrids in stop and go or city traffic because I hate having the ICE uselessly run such cases and knowing that all my braking in a non-hybrid results in the car's kinetic energy being converted into useless heat and brake dust. With hybrids, at least some energy is being recaptured and can be repurposed for later use.

    Don't let all of this scare or intimidate you. It's best just to drive it, at first. Ask questions as they come up and when you have more context. Much of what you read here on Priuschat might seem abstract.
     
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  11. citygirl

    citygirl New Member

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    Sadly, my quest to get a Prius is not going to happen. I used the usaa.com service, received a price, called the dealer (verified very specifically the availability), set an appointment, drove 40+ miles to the dealer this morning, was told that they didn't have it (nor did they 2 days ago when I set my appt). Manager searched inventory. Found one. Asked me if I would buy today. Said I would. Reminded him of the usaa.com quote they had provided. Then he switched tactics and asked what I wanted for my 2007 MDX. Told him to make me an offer, blah, blah, blah. As soon as he knew I was not going to play the "trade-in value to make up for purchase of new car price", the car he had just located for me (and offered to deliver to my house) was no longer available.
    Grossinger Toyota in Chicago sucks.
     
  12. FLteacher

    FLteacher Junior Member

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    I know you're disappointed. Are there any other dealers nearby that you can deal with? Or is selling your car privately an option?
     
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  13. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Yowza! Sounds like a case of bait and switch. It seems numerous Chicagoland Priuschat regulars have complained about Toyota dealers. :(

    Hopefully you can find a better dealer.
     
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  14. Lori 08

    Lori 08 Junior Member

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    I tried to deal over the internet with Grossinger. Glad I didn't make the trip down there. Bought my 2010 closer to home in Wisconsin
     
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  15. citygirl

    citygirl New Member

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    I could sell my car privately, but Grossinger will not honor the usaa.com price they quoted me. Bad, bad karma for them! Have been looking around but the dealers are increasing the prices daily! At some point, the gas savings is mitigated by overpaying for the car. Sigh. :(
     
  16. MSK

    MSK Junior Member

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    @citygirl....when I was shopping for my prius I got the same crummy sales run-arounds from Grossinger. I would NEVER deal with them. My wife and I ended up bying from Toyota of Merrillville (Indiana) and got great service. We bought the last one that they had so you would have to call them to find out when they are expecting more. They also tried to lowball me at first (as I would have expected) on my trade but we ended up negotiating a more than fair price. In the end it all worked out very well. Feel free to PM me if you have any other questions.

    MK