Why did you buy a plug in and not an electric car.

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-Current)' started by padroo, Dec 27, 2017.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    As customer, built a PDP-8 interface to an async chip to transfer documentation to a DEC-20 terminal line. Also, an early RSX OS whose compiler did not generate a hardware multiply instruction even though the hardware had it. So a simple assembler subroutine and the problem was solved with a significant speed up. I've also written a few VMS device drivers and diagnosed non-interuptable, loops with a logic analyzer including one in memory clean-up during task termination. I shared that at a DECUS convention in a hallway conversation and it was fixed in the next release. Once own a VAX 730, nice space heater, and optimized the boot tape to reduce boot time to 1/3d of the stock, 8mm boot tape. Then there was 'SuperSniff', a VAX workstation using a 'parasitic' driver that recorded ethernet traffic to 8mm cassette, 10 tape bin. This led me into network operations and engineering.

    Oh along the way, I reluctantly joined the Unix cult. But at least I could get a Debian source kit and build my own.

    Bob Wilson
     
  2. AnneLW

    AnneLW Member

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    I preferred a plug-in because I am paranoid somebody would unplug my car somewhere I am charging it as a "joke."
     
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  3. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

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    Most have a locking mechanism.
     
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  4. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    My BMW unlocks the J1772 when the car is charged so we don't get into "plug wars." I haven't check the Prime, yet.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  5. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

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    Leaf's have this option as well
     
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  6. Old Bear

    Old Bear Senior Member

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    I don't know if this is true for all of the trims, but the Advanced version of the Prime has this feature:

    J1772-connector-lock.jpg

    For those with more faith in the fundamental goodness of their fellow human beings, there's also this rather nice low-tech alternative:

    car-charging-tags.jpg

    Kind of like the "Do Not Disturb / Please Make Up This Room" tags that one hangs on hotel doorknobs.

    car-charging-tags-2.jpg
     
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  7. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

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    I like the idea behind those tags but only a minority of spots have enough room by them for another vehicle to park next to it. Usually the ratio is 1:1 of plugs to parking spots.
     
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  8. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Source: Nissan takes a step backward in electrification, introduces gas-powered range extender without plug | Electrek

    . . . the Japanese automaker is now taking a huge and confusing step backward in electrification by introducing a gas-powered range extender called ‘E-Power’ without a plug?!

    Of course, Nissan presented the new product this week as “moving forward its electrification strategy”, but it looks like it was designed by the Koch brothers.

    The gas-powered range extender is nothing new. BMW has been offering one in the i3 for quite some time now. They basically make an over-complicated drivetrain to remove the dreaded “range anxiety”, but as James May, who recently got rid of his BMW i3 with range extender in order to go full electric, said: “it’s a form of cowardice”.

    Here’s the full quote from a recent interview:

    “What I’ve actually ordered a new car, haven’t I? I’ve got an i3, but I ordered a new i3, because it has an improved battery. And I’ve gone for no range extender. I did have that before, but I felt that was a form of cowardice, so I’ve abandoned that.”
    The idea behind a range extender is that unlike a regular hybrid vehicle, the electric powertrain is always the one powering the wheels and the gas engine is only recharging the battery. Like the Chevy Volt, but the vehicle has never been referred to as having a “range extender” since it’s the only version of the vehicle available, but the name came about when it was made an option on vehicles that are also offered in fully electric.

    Attempts to 'green-shame' from this November 2016 article using terms like "cowardice" often backfire:
    [​IMG]

    Bob Wilson
     
    #188 bwilson4web, Jan 23, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2018
  9. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    The Volt isn't a series hybrid/range extender, as far as I know. It's a hybrid similar (but different) to the Prius/Prius Prime. In other words, it does have a mechanical connection from the engine to the wheels, correct?
     
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  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Yes and the Volt looks relatively complex based on the system schematics I've seen compared to the Prius and Prime. The Volt transmission has too many clutches.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  11. KokomoKid

    KokomoKid Member

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    Yep, the Volt has a mechanical connection from the engine to the wheels, at least at highway speed.

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  12. KokomoKid

    KokomoKid Member

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    I agree with the article that the Nissan E-power makes no sense. It will be a gas hog, especially at highway speed, combining the inefficiencies of the electric motor and generator, which would be much higher than a gear transmission.

    Regarding the i3, they are off base. The i3 REx makes complete sense, for those who will do most of their driving on plug-in power, but will want to use the car for occasional longer trips. The mpg on gas is not too great with the i3 REx, but if 95% is on plug-in power, so what.

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  13. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    The i3 REx makes no sense to me at all because of it's ridiculous gas tank. I've literally owned a trolling motor with a larger gas tank.
     
  14. KokomoKid

    KokomoKid Member

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    The thing the Volt has over the Prime, is that it has "full power" without the ICE running, as long as the battery has juice. With battery charge, the engine doesn't run, even when you floor it. Some people like that.

    I like the simplicity of the Prius and Prime powertrain better. I've heard that the Prime powertrain isn't quite as simple, though, and has at least one clutch, for using both MG's without the ICE. Is that correct?



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  15. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    You can floor the Prime without the engine running. I've done 0-60, 0-70 and several 0-40 timed runs in mine in Ev mode.

    Sort of. It has a sprag clutch. This is a very simple, passive device. It's a one-way clutch that only allows the engine to spin forward.
     
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  16. KokomoKid

    KokomoKid Member

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    Yeah, the tiny gas tank is not great, but you are always within range of a gas station, and it takes only about 20 seconds to get another 70 miles or so of range.

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  17. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    That's not true.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  18. KokomoKid

    KokomoKid Member

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    Thanks for the info

    Posted via android app

    OK, most places are within range of a gas station. No, an i3 REx is not the car to use for driving across the Nevada desert, to Alaska from Florida, etc. It's basically a city car, but with more flexibility than, say, a Nissan Leaf.

    Posted via android app
     
    #198 KokomoKid, Jan 23, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 23, 2018
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  19. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Just sharing some 'lessons learned':
    The Prius mileage trick is to maximize engine operation at peak efficiency. The e-Power should easily accomplish this task by using the battery to buffer the engine so it only operates at peak efficiency. It should be easily competitive in urban driving and I'll wait to see the highway mileage.
    It has a 'one-way clutch' that prevents the engine from turning backwards AND allows MG1 and MG2 to work like a single motor. My impression is the Volt actually has mechanical clutches with actuators under the Volt control laws.

    Bob Wilson
     
  20. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    Mainly when the battery is depleted and the drivetrain is under a heavy load.
     
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