Why is Toyota limiting production of Rav4 Primes?

Discussion in 'Toyota Hybrids and EVs' started by The Big Sleaze, Dec 27, 2020.

  1. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Just checked with a local Toyota dealer on the availability of Rav4 Prime. None for the next 8 weeks. Every RP allocated to the dealer is already spoken for with deposit. I am not interested in paying a full MSRP of RP, do I move on for search of a car to replace my PP.
     
  2. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    ^^^My 2020 RAV4H has the fuel refill issue, I will try to get it fixed in a month or two at 10K mile check. Just got my letter from Toyota a few days ago.

    I swear to god it is exactly same issue as older Gen2 Prius I traded in, which only filled to 6-gal.
    As far as RAV4H, they claim a subtle change in gas tank shape design made the affected tanks fill up 2-3 gallon short of full.

    RAV4 Prime seems to me the first PHEV where nothing is sacrificed. I think you get spare tire and same cargo space as the other models. For me as a Virginian the $28K hybrid was a better cost choice because we have no state incentives, and we actually have a disincentive of significant higher annual car taxes on more expensive cars. Other states it would be nicer to get the Prime (in theory).
     
    #22 wjtracy, Dec 28, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
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  3. mikefocke

    mikefocke Prius v Three 2012, Avalon 2011

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    The RAv4 hybrid fuel fill Customer Satisfaction Program fix (CSP-0109-020) was announced on October 29th. I've had 4 fills since mine was fixed and no issues since. The problem was over-hyped by a few who wanted 560 miles per tank and the poor dears were actually having to fill up after 450. It never cost me a single MPG.

    Toyota marketing overstated the range in its brochures and there is a class action over the issue. But if that is the only problem a new car has, you are way ahead of the typical new car buyer's experience. It was for me the only one.
     
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  4. Rmay635703

    Rmay635703 Senior Member

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    All Toyota plug ins are sold regionally based on manufacturer credits .

    So although in theory you can buy one anywhere you will tend to find a Toyota plug in located in a state with heavy manufacturer credits.
    States like MA where demand is low but manufacturer incentives are plentiful and larger than other states create interesting islands of deals.
    while other states with downright decentives won’t have a Prime until one comes in used as a trade in.

    Hopefully someday this changes but I don’t see allotments moving much, nor do I see nationwide RAV4 Primes on every lot happening anytime soon.
     
  5. The Big Sleaze

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    good to hear Gas Tank issue is now a non-issue.

    Tesla owners buying Rav4 Primes, for pretty much same common sense reasons I'd take a Toyota over Tesla. Tesla Owners Are Buying Toyota RAV4 Prime Plug-in Hybrids – Here’s Why | Torque News If lots of customers of what suddenly became the highest cap value automaker in the world are seeking out a particular model of other maker, I'd say full speed ahead with that particular model. Personally, I'd like to see Toyota make Prime trucks, especially with a 220/110v output feature.

    "if the % of automotive parts from, 'murica' are what's important, perhaps consider a Honda or corvette" Sad to say but one of the main factors in buying a new Prime was "100% Japan parts and assembly". While I know they aren't really related, trips to dealerships in USA only reinforced that feeling. I'd pay an extra $200 if I was allowed to take delivery onboard ship and drive it down the ramp myself, just for peace of mind.
     
  6. The Big Sleaze

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    What exactly are you calling "manufacturer credits"? Are MCs what these people are calling "tax credits"manufacturer credits EV at DuckDuckGo, or are your MCs "Toyota Cash Back" from Toyota you sign over to dealer at sale to reduce sales price? And is that all about Toyota meeting State required EV sales quotas so they don't need to buy Markers from Tesla?
     
  7. Rmay635703

    Rmay635703 Senior Member

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    States (primarily CARB) create quotas for plug ins that provide direct cash or tax benefits to manufacturers when they sell a plug in that state.

    AKA You get a federal rebate Toyota as a manufacturer itself also gets $$$ which varies state to state and in some cases is based on battery size or drivetrain (Mirai)

    In a few cases (Normal IL) the dealer would get benefits alongside county/municipal benefits to the buyer.
     
  8. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Minnesota is in the process of adopting California rules now and at no point has "direct cash or tax benefits to manufacturers" ever been brought up. No mention whatsoever makes me question that claim. Please provide a link.

    What has been stated is that beginning in 2024 for 2025 model years here, automakers will be required to provide a supply of plug-in vehicles. Failing that provision would make the automaker ineligible to continue sales in the state.
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i got your tax payments in a nice rebate from the guv'mint when i purchased my toyota plug in, thank you!:cool:
     
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    iirc, mfg's get cali carb credits when they sell a carb approved vehicle in carb states. that's why toyota has dropped their pants and bent over in the northeast for the last 8 years.
     
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  11. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    Actually, you got your own tax payments.;)
     
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  12. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    but i don't pay taxes :whistle:
     
  13. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Manufactures need to generate ZEV credits by selling approved zero emission vehicles. The amount needed is a percentage of the car's they sell in CARB states.

    They don't make the amount needed, they pay a fine; it's like CAFE in that way. Those that produce over their needed credits can sell them to those that need them.
     
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  14. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    Then you get no federal tax refund :(
     
  15. vvillovv

    vvillovv Senior Member

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    It couldn't be that Toyota is not expecting to sell a boat load of them, could it?

    drats! no leftovers for scavengers like me.....
     
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  16. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Yeah, Toyota underestimated demand. They had to stop taking orders in Japan for this year months ago.
     
  17. vvillovv

    vvillovv Senior Member

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    supply and demand - or - poor estimated sales. FOUR!
     
  18. mikefocke

    mikefocke Prius v Three 2012, Avalon 2011

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    Or their battery source only agreed to produce a certain number of cells for them as others hopping on the same bandwagon and responding to the same regulatory imperatives had locked the battery-makers capacity up already.
     
  19. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    agreed but I don't think the public (and John) realize that.
    It really quite enormous mandate which makes the plug-ins artificially cheaper since they must be sold, forces Detroit to go that way, and to boot you the buyer get huge tax rebate. And free HOV in Ca. Quite an enormous gov push for plug-ins going on almost 10 years.
     
  20. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    A credit for CARB use is neither "cash" nor "tax". Remember who set the precedent and think about what it means for relations like Tesla & Stellantis.
     
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