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Why the BMW i3-REx

Discussion in 'EV (Electric Vehicle) Discussion' started by bwilson4web, May 15, 2016.

  1. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Ditto for my Leaf. I do sometimes pre-heat or pre-cool the car remotely via the NissanConnect formerly Carwings app or set a timer via their app. I don't use the car's pre-conditioning timers.

    One annoying thing is that you can't set the desired temp remotely (not via web site nor app). You can only change it via the menus on the car. So, it's currently set to 72 F. In earlier model years (I know on 2011, but not sure about 2012), you couldn't even change it, so Nissan meant for it to be preheat to some unknown temp.

    Be careful using the i3's auto park system. I've seen many reports (including seeing a video) where the car will hit the curb and retrying doesn't help. In some cases, I've seen pics where it parked WAY too close to the curb and in others, it's damaged wheels (curb rash). If I had an i3 with it, I wouldn't use it, unless I didn't care about curb rash. It's apparently very buggy.
     
  2. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I thought about that but a seasonal temperature, 76-78F in the summer, and say 64-68F winter is not that big of a burden. The heated seats might allow a lower range in the winter.

    I understand that the parallel parking may be buggy and requires monitoring of what is going on. This evening it worked perfectly and as I got out, I saw the sign "ZIP CAR PARKING'. Huh??? ZIP CAR in Huntsville???

    Bob Wilson
     
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    civilization coming, to to relocate.;)
     
  4. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I've completed my highway model:
    • 65 mph (indicate mph) is 24x7, sustainable speed
    • Block-to-block speed with 15 min refueling is 50-53 mph (last quarter of tank)
    • Block-to-block, 40 MPG
    Any faster and the traction battery is slowly drained until the REx can no longer maintain speed. The battery drain, ~20%, means ONLY three cycles if starting at 75% and the REx enabled. At 75 mph, the block-to-block speed only goes up 5 mph over 65 mph indicated. Worse the fuel economy falls to 32 MPG from 40 MPG.

    Prius measured data:
    • 52 MPG@65 mph - Gen-1
    • 52 MPG@70 mph - Gen-3
    Questions?

    Bob Wilson
     
    #105 bwilson4web, Jul 6, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2016
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I've been giving "demo drives" at work and learning more about how others drive and use their cars. Wednesday it was a guy who lives about 70 miles away. Without a charger at work, the BMW i3-REx would not work without coding and using the REx daily. He liked the acceleration and power but when I explained why 65 mph is the highest block-to-block speed, you could tell it was a deal breaker.

    Now I'm OK with this because people need a car that meets their requirements. He'd heard from his wife that 'hybrids have no power.' I did not mention the next generation PiP but because it has the ability to use both MG1 and MG2, it may meet the acceleration requirement.

    As for the BMW i3-REx and highway performance, the answer is an after-body to reduce aerodynamic drag. It could also carry 2-gallon spare gas cans to shorten the refueling time and widen the range of where to refuel.

    Bob Wilson
     
  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    When driving under 65mph, to what point will the range extender charge the battery? Will it just shut off at the 75% hold limit, or go above it?
     
  8. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    The best the range extender will do is maintain the SOC found when you enable it. If regen brings the SOC higher, the range extender shuts down.

    In an ideal world, you could identify what SOC % to maintain but it isn't coded that way. You have to wait until it is 75% or less and upon enabling, the range extender tries to keep it there.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  9. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    So the ICE will vary output to the speed traveling then, or does it "pulse and glide" on an efficient output?
     
  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I don't have the chart handy but it looks a lot like an Adkinsonized version of the motorcycle engine. The training materials indicate the engine does 'warm-up' before producing power which makes a lot of sense. The only significant thing missing is cooled-EGR.

    Bob Wilson
     
  11. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    I was wondering if it ran at a single, or two or three, set speeds, with any electric production in excess of propulsion needs going to the battery.
     
  12. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Not that I can tell but I am just getting my OBD instrumentation setup. I can already tell some 'claims' about how the car works may be not be so accurate. But Argonne Labs has publicly available data.

    Here is one early chart from an Argonne test:
    [​IMG]
    The layers suggest:
    1. 10 kW level
    2. 7.5 kW level
    3. 0 kW level
    4. -1.5 kW level - starting the REx and warm-up??
    There is a wealth of data at Argonne that I've not dived into, yet. My focus is more on getting OBD data and metrics from my car so I can investigate obscure areas they may not have benchmarked. For example, last weekend I ran a 75 mph benchmark. Also, I'm interesting the BSFC vs generator output. I want to know what is going on when at 75 mph the car gets 32 MPG. Also, how the REx output varies as the difference between the set SOC and actual increases.

    Bob Wilson

    ps. Attached a training file about the engine.
     

    Attached Files:

    #112 bwilson4web, Jul 8, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2016
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  13. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Cost: $4,770.00

    Replace 1968, 100A service with 200A service and added NEMA 14-50 for charging the BMW i3-REx:

    [​IMG]
    The original service cable had aged so much that the insulation was in patches and the "common" was exposed, loosely to the elements. The two hot wires were visible. This photo shows where the utility meter goes.

    [​IMG]
    The technician is holding the control wires from the natural gas powered, emergency generator. The utility service enters from the top and feeds the circuit breaker panel on the lower right. The left cables are the power lines from the generator. The emergency generator comes on automatically 12 seconds after loss of power and isolates the generator power from the utility line. When the utility service returns, the service switches over and the gas engine shutsdown.

    [​IMG]
    The gas line to the generator means no toting gasoline to the engine and filling a small tank. We're talking days, weeks of operation as long as the utility company provides natural gas.

    [​IMG]
    Now this is the 19th century generator. Huge compared to MG1 coupled to an air-cooled engine. I would prefer a liquid cooled engine so waste heat could be salvaged. But good enough for now. At 16kW, it has enough power to charge the BMW i3-REx.

    [​IMG]
    This is the former distribution box with the fuse holders. It was in service ~48 years.

    [​IMG]
    Instead of the original 100A service, we upgraded to 200A ... big thick cables.

    Now a skeptic would say, $4770 / $2 ~= 2,385 gallons. But the service line was weather aged and unsafe. With the hot weather, air conditioners have been working overtime and huh ... house fires. BTW, the NEMA 14-50 is 50A wire and 50A circuit breaker, 12 kW. Our BMW i3-REx has 7.4 kW, built-in charging capability, ~32A, so it should be pretty efficient.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #113 bwilson4web, Jul 11, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2016
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  14. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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    Very nice. Besides amperage, was there a particular reason you went with NEMA 14-50?

    We had two NEMA 14-50's installed, one each at opposite sides of the garage, one for the PiP initially then later for the Leaf. Amperage was important for future needs, but two other things also led to this plug type. One of these was simply not going hardwired so we could take the Clipper Creek units with us if we sold the house. The other was that if we got adventurous, we could take the NEMA 14-50 Clipper Creek units on the road to charge at RV camping sites where these are the most common plug types.
     
  15. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I bought the JuiceBox with WiFi rated at 40A for the same reason ... RV park.

    The BMW connect is OK but not enough engineering data. The JuiceBox appears to have the metrics I want.

    Bob Wilson
     
  16. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Bob: Wow, I think you'll be a valuable addition to the i3 community w/all of your experiments and findings.

    Too bad you didn't join the world of Leafs. You can still buy used ones for cheap and help contribute in Leaf-land. :D

    Folks like Turbo3 have done some interesting stuff: iOS Version of Leaf Spy development discussion - My Nissan Leaf Forum. I use the Android version. He lives about 2 miles from me and needed a '13+ Leaf w/Around View Monitor for some feature work. So, I loaned it to him on Friday night and we did have 2 semi-brief conversations.

    He posted iOS Version of Leaf Spy development discussion - Page 27 - My Nissan Leaf Forum about his latest work. It's interesting is that it seems he's retrieving the firmware versions of various ECUs along w/serial numbers of certain items. He deduced SM for battery = Smryna (where the North American Leafs are built now and where Nissan has a big battery plant). From his earlier post, JT makes sense since he has an '11 Leaf and they were made in Japan back then, so the batteries most definitely were from Japan.
     
  17. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    They seem to like my bon mots. <GRINS>

    Of course I'm biased but I kinda like: (1) strong motor, and (2) averaging range extender. I need to do more research but this is not a common architecture. Perhaps the Fisker?

    What I'm finding is high-speeds greater than 65 mph, long distance, the BMW i3-REx is not the answer. But if you can do your cross country at 65 mph, the BMW i3-REx fully meets at least my requirements with 40 MPG. Our 2003 Prius gave 52 MPG at the same, 65 mph.

    Bob Wilson
     
  18. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    That said, even with an averaging range extender, I can see some benefits of a power split architecture, as long as MG2 is sufficiently large.

    In EV mode, it can act as a one-motor EV using the smaller motor at low power demands, improving efficiency compared to a larger (BLDC/synchronous AC, anyway) motor. (It's worth noting that Tesla went for asynchronous AC induction motors due to their lower cogging torque, despite being less efficient at peak, because they were spending so little time anywhere near peak output.) Or, at high demand, it can act as a two-motor EV, using a one-way clutch.

    Weight may even be saved by the MG2 equivalent being lighter than one that is dedicated to driving the vehicle. (MG1 probably still needs to be big, to be able to absorb 100% of engine output at a stop, though.)

    Then, with a power split device, the ICE can deliver its power through a mechanical path to the wheels, unlike the inefficient electrical path as used in the i3.
     
  19. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    Bob, Welcome to the 21st century! (y) I have a 12 year old 12kw propane gen with a nice little air cooled Honda. Has proved its worth over the years. Still runs like new, and original 12v.
     
  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    It's a question of balancing trade offs. A power split with a mechanical connection to the wheels can be more efficient in hybrid mode, but it puts limits on packaging. The electrical path is less efficient, but the only limit on where the ICE is placed is the exhaust and emission systems. This can mean more space for traction batteries.

    Longer EV range lessens the cost of poorer hybrid efficiency. It will shift the user's fuel consumption from miles per gallon to gallons per week, month, or year.