1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Why the government is out of touch and control

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by malorn, Feb 21, 2006.

  1. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    I am somewhat active politically and want to run for office in the next five years. I go to too many fundraisers and get hit up for contributions as much or more than the next guy. I have thought that money was a corrupting influence on our political system for years but only recently gained some first-hand knowledge as to what extent.

    Over the last month I have been doing some negotiating with TV stations for advertising. Most of the TV stations in this area will only guarantee placement through July. Wanting to make sure any ads we run are in "prime" placement I questioned why there could be no quarantees through the fall and football season.
    I was amazed by the response from every TV station I was talking to: it is political season in the fall and even though it is an 'off-year' with no presidential election the usual media buying frenzy will surely take place.

    It seems the closer one gets to election day the more the officals are willing to pay for 'prime' placement. The premium paid ranges from 4 times the normal ad rates in late August to 15 times the normal rate in late October. Maybe it is just me but I was sickened by the whole scenario. An ad say I would pay $2-400 for in late October is sold to the highest political bidder for maybe $2-3000.

    I now have realized why we will not have any real changes in the American political system for a long time. I know some of you will say I am lynching the media again, but who has more power to determine what is are the important issues of the day than the mdia bosses. Why on earth would 'real' campaign finance reform ever make it off the back burner. My dealings were on a fairly local level but I can imagine the windfall realized at a state-wide and national level.
    :angry:
     
  2. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    2,366
    4
    0
    Location:
    Bloomfield Hills, MI
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    The media is big business these days. Gone are the stalwart journalists of the Watergate era who weren't afraid to piss someone off. The so-called journalists of today never answer any really tough questions and don't grab hold of the politician or corporate talkinghead by the toe and not let go until they squeal. The media is part of the problem, not THE problem. It's always refreshing when someone in the media or a politician actually does what they're supposed to do.

    A recent BusinessWeek article reports that politicians shake down lobbying groups for money all the time, as opposed to the popular image of the lobbyist being the agressor. So, if you get elected, you can look forward to the day when you can shake down the media groups for money to get back what they shook you down for.
     
  3. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Honestly, the money factor has made me re-think my political ambitions. If I was elected I would try to make 'real' campaign finance reform my number one issue. Unfortunately I don't think I would say much about it during the election or the media would crucify me and my election chances would be nill. :(
     
  4. Begreen

    Begreen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2006
    670
    10
    0
    Location:
    Western WA state
    Vehicle:
    Other Electric Vehicle
    Model:
    N/A
    You are right, it takes $30K just to shake the hand of a rep that is on "our" payroll. Whatta system. I'd like to see them pull the plug on ALL TV/Radio political advertising.
     
  5. Mystery Squid

    Mystery Squid Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2005
    2
    3
    0
    Are you running for something local, or more "state-wide"?
     
  6. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    2,366
    4
    0
    Location:
    Bloomfield Hills, MI
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Naw, if you ran on the finance reform banner, elected politicians would consider you a threat and have the media people who are in their pockets crucify you. Either that, or the politician would investigate you at taxpayer expense and offer the media a nice juicy story based on one percent truth and 99% innuendo. The media loves great stories because more people read or watch which means that they can earn more money in ads. Hatred of the media will get you nailed faster though. Because then they'll do it themselves out of spite. Your almost pathological hatred of the media is misguided. As I said, they're part of the problem, not THE problem. If you're a mailman and you have a house on your route with a vicious watchdog, the instinct is to consider the watchdog to be the problem but the real problem is the person who lives in the house.
     
  7. Walker1

    Walker1 Empire

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2006
    911
    6
    0
    Location:
    FL
    Vehicle:
    2014 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I was going to run for a county position. After researching & networking with some important movers & shakers it was determined that the cost would be $150,000-$300,000. And that was not the reason I didn't pursue it.

    I had no name recognition or lots of $$. However, the biggest problem was I don't belong to any civic organizations. I would have had the financial backing if I was a "joiner."

    As to politics, if you got a cushy elected position with all the benefits & perks that come with it would you want to lose that position later? You would have to go back to being a working person again. That has to be a politician's worst nightmare. That's why there's no real changes. Politicians love the status quo.
     
  8. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    The office I am being encouraged to run for is in the state senate in 2008. the current senator will be retiring.
     
  9. Mystery Squid

    Mystery Squid Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2005
    2
    3
    0
    I guess what I was getting at, is I'm not really sure public television is the way to go... After all, how many people actually watch non-cable TV (assuming, of course, you're either attempting to advertise on one of those "community" channels, or a somewhat local area broadcaster).

    For example, our local Congress rep. I would have had NO IDEA who she was, until she actually knocked on my door one day. Her name, is the only name I know, regardless of who else is running because I simply don't pay attention to most advertising.

    I think people in my/our age group (soon to be, dare I say, the "primary voting contingency"), don't really actually physically read newspapers, nor watch "regular" TV anymore...

    I guess I'm just questioning just how effective it actually is.
     
  10. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    I agree with you MS. If you were to determine my advertising budget to reach male and females under 40 how would you do it? I am fairly close in age to you and I am not that touched by the traditional forms of media. I just finished meeting with a radio rep and will see a tv rep this afternoon. If I wanted to sell you a car or get you to vote for me how do I reach you? The TV guys want me to advertise on American Idol and the like and truthfully I rarely watch tv and if I do it is not watching American Idol.
     
  11. LaughingMan

    LaughingMan Active Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2005
    1,386
    2
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, MA
    From the perspective of someone who's definitely "new media"... i'd start thinking about non traditional media like the web. There's a certain grassroots and raw nature of new mediums... it feels unfiltered and honest. Start a weblog. Do a podcast. etc etc. Think about the Howard Dean model...

    Just a few ideas. I have no idea how to run a campaign. :lol:
     
  12. Mystery Squid

    Mystery Squid Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2005
    2
    3
    0
    Off the top of my head, come knocking on my door, or somehow get your word out on the various local newspaper/BB SITES I visit, AND/OR send me an interesting piece of mail I just won't toss, for mail is ALWAYS a point of contact for me, I HAVE to sift through it everyday... But then again, that IS just me.
     
  13. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid

    I am not a Howard Dean fan but look what the media did to him in 2004, they destroyed his canidacy. The senate office will probably not be a tough race if I decide to run. 2-4 years after that I would like to run for Congress, that would be a bloodbath in my area.
     
  14. LaughingMan

    LaughingMan Active Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2005
    1,386
    2
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, MA
    Well this seems like one place where we agree. The media is problem #1 when it comes to money in the game of politics nowadays.

    Everyone seems to forget that the airwaves were trusted to the media companies for the public good. They get to make money off of it, but in return, they agree to provide a public service by providing news. As a part of their charter, we should mandate free air time to political candidates to take money out of the equation... but with the days of these big media companies being a power unto themselves, I don't see that happening...
     
  15. LaughingMan

    LaughingMan Active Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2005
    1,386
    2
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, MA
    Howard Dean had a few failures at the hand of the media, but my point was that he ran a relatively successful and unconventional grassroots campaign through the primaries. I feel he's made a difference in the way small mobile campaigns can be run.
     
  16. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Great idea Laughingman, could that get around the first amendment problems that the media companies hide behind when campaign finance reform is brought up. If you gave every candidate equal free time on the airwaves could that work? The more I find out about campaign season the more it seems like three months of Superbowl rates creating a veritable orgy of money and corruption.
     
  17. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    640
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    I hate to burst your innocent bubble, but *all* politicians - from the County/Municipal level on up - are corrupt, evil, lying pupae wiggling around in their own poop.

    The political game is the ultimate Old Boys Club: it's not what you know, but who you blow. The first priority is to sell your soul to the highest bidder, and it goes downhill from there.

    My Dad had a very close friend who ran for elected office in Michigan back in the early 70's. He had the money and some influence, and thought he could really "clean things up." He was also very naive of how the backroom deals were made, as he inherited his money, not stabbed folks in the back for it in the biz world.

    Instead he discovered the slimy underside of politics, including how campaigns are really run. The lies, the backroom deals, outright threats and blackmail. He had a heart attack a few years after losing the election, and my Dad still tells me some of the juicier stories as a warning NOT to trust *any* politician.

    It you even *hinted* at "real" campaign finance reform, you'd be tarred and feathered.

    Getting back to your topic title, the gov is out of touch because we allowed it to be: we put an arm's length barrier between ourselves and the political machinery, AKA The Bureaucracy - and that serves to faithfully insulate politicians from all but the most serious misdeeds they commit.
     
  18. LaughingMan

    LaughingMan Active Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2005
    1,386
    2
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, MA
    I'm no constitutional scholar... but it always seemed to rub me the wrong way when the argument is made that money and donations for political candidates is free speech.

    Though each of us are equal under the idea of one man one vote, when it comes to the campaign, it's the dollars that do the voting... So while a billionare and a guy raking in mimimum wage are equal, one is more equal than the other...

    It seems like through campaigns... we aren't even hiding how close we are to an outright oligarchy.

    Bothersome.
     
  19. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    I don't have quite as hopeless an attitude about it as you do, but I think you are pretty close to the mark.

    About 15 years ago the state was proposing a new road near one of the stores so they wanted my dad to chair the committee to study the need for a bypass or improvements to the existing road. Of course for a number of political reasons the state wanted a new road bypassing the existing road. After holding community meetings for eight years and building a consensus for improvements to the existing road for a number of reasons including to control sprawl, the state gathered the information, patted everyone involved on the back and decided to build a new road.

    It was the most blatant abuse of power adn money I have ever witnessed. The most ironic thing is they spent 55% of the money needed to improve the existing road 'studying' and 'lobbying' the need for a new road. It is a wonder we don't just sign 100% of our income over to the different levels of government.
     
  20. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2004
    15,140
    611
    0
    Location:
    South Puget Sound, WA
    Vehicle:
    2013 Nissan LEAF
    Model:
    Persona
    sorry but politicians get to me only one way. do something that makes news. be on TV handing out dinners to the poor, be going door to door in person collecting donations for a MS (multiple scrrocsi not squid!!) walkathon...that gets my attention. or be in the editorial of the newspaper speaking your mind.

    i immediately tune out all political advertising of any kind. imm, you be doing nothing but wasting your money