Will I make It up my Driveway?

Good question.

First of all, the car doesn't stall or turn off in those sort of conditions.

When you're on glare ice or very slippery snow, the traction control kicks in and severely limits the power applied to the front drive wheels. It doesn't matter if I floor it or pretend there is an egg between the pedal and my foot, the car will barely creep at a walking pace.

Last week, on the outside parking ramp at a mall, the car simply stopped 1/3 way up the ramp, with the VSC icon on the dash. I had no choice but to back down the ramp.

This is just another good reason to install proper snow/winter tires. I can see if you live in a place like Lost Wages or LA and only occasionally drive into the mountains. Maybe just keep chains in the hatch.

For places like Salt Lake City, Park City, or Deer Valley Utah, where I used to live, the winter tires plus chains will save your a**. Here in Manitoba, ditto.

Will have to stop at some tire shops after work and see about Bridgestone Blizzak's or Dunlop Graspic DS-2's. My Toyota dealer has bad news, more delays in getting them.

 

I imagine better rated tires for snow would help some, but is it reasonable to think you could get many non SUV ground clearance vehicles up that slope in 8" of snow?

 

Good question. I remember that my automatic '96 Chev Cavalier Z24 had an on/off switch for the traction control. Seems like a possible solution for an enterprising after market product developer. Coastal Dave, you listening?

 

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I had some time today after work so I headed out to a fairly empty and VERY icy parking lot. I wanted to put this Traction Control in R to rest.

I came to a stop on the icy surface and floored it in D. As expected, the VSC Icon came on and the car barely moved forward.

I then shifted into R and floored it: oops, the VSC Icon came on and the car barely moved! That answers that question, doesn't it??

Something tells me those d*** winter tires had better come in pronto. If I ever get "slightly" stuck, I'm S.O.L. I wouldn't be able to go forward OR backward!

I wish the Prius had a VSC disable switch. There are some conditions where you NEED wheelspin, say trying to drive up a slippery/snowy hill. With the proper tires, they can dig down a bit and catch, and away you go.

A buddy of mine who lives in NW Ontario recently picked up a Lease Return 2002 Buick Century with under 20,000km on it. Hint: never buy one new, the depreciation is horrific.

Anyway, he has to drive down 15km of gravel sideroad, and one very steep hill, to get to his spread. With Bridgestone Blizzak WS-50 on all four wheels, he can usually make it most of the way no problem if the road hasn't been plowed.

On that steep hill, if it's icy or more than 6 inches of snow, the Buick traction control will kick in. Once, he even ground to a stop around halfway up the hill.

He poked the Traction Disable button at the end of the column shifter and gave it some gas. The Blizzak's were able to dig down and catch, and he could proceed. In my Prius, I would probably be stuck there.

 

Sounds like it was a good idea that I kept my Ford Explorer for bad weather. I guess I could get studded snow tires but the Ford is sitting there and I would rather have a dent in the Ford than the baby.

 

VSC Disable Switch. hmmmm. Sounds like a mod for coastal Dave.

Are you listening??

-j

 

Well, I have to say that I am glad I don't live in an area where the roads get icy, but it does happen where my parents live. I hope I don't get stuck when I go to visit. What I can't believe is Toyota would design such huge flaw into the Prius, let alone any car. I don't like the idea of getting stuck because the car simply won't turn the wheels. I hope Toyota comes up with a solution to this.

Justin

 

Lets not confuse Traction Control (Standard on every Prius) with VSC (Stablility Control - Optional).

They are two very different things.

The Traction Control is what prevents the wheel spin.

However, if you disabled the Traction Control on the Prius, you'd void every warrantee in sight. It's there because it's required to prevent over-revving of the MGs.

For better or worse, it's part of the Prius.

 

I found some pictures on Toyota's Japan website that might help out with the distinction between VSC (vehicle stability control) and traction control. I can't read what any of it says but the diagram is pretty self explainitory. The green arrows show how the car reacts with VSC and the blue arrows are without VSC. Pretty much the car senses when there is an oversteering or understeering condition and corrects its course by strategically applying the brakes.

Justin

 

In the Prius, it appears the Trac and VSC are integrated. That is, wheelspin turns on the VSC icon. I tried some silly maneuvers in that icy parking lot and a slide also turns on the VSC icon.

I think +90% of the time, the Trac is a very good idea. I don't think any engineer can cover EVERY operating situation. So I'm not in any way saying Toyota has a design flaw.

Though it might be a good idea to have a Trac Disable feature, even a momentary disable instead of a latching disable, just to get you through the situation you're in.

That said, I'm confident good studless or studded winter tires would go a long way to making this issue go away. I may have to call Tire Rack and go through the nonsense of a Import Broker just to get winter tires.

 

Sorry for revisiting this old thread.
I experienced this twice in my first 1000 miles - can't get up my driveway! Prius just won't move ... until I hop out, grab the shovel and bag of of salt ...

Does anyone have experience with any of the following products:

Tyre-Grip Tire Spray
or
Liquid Spray Tire Chain / Grip

Seems like these could help...??

 

I carry a small container of Kitty Litter in winter for extra traction. I don't like using salt as it tends to get thrown up into the wheelwells and onto the brake hardware and cause corrosion.

Sand provides much better traction especially on glare ice. Cheap Kitty Litter works well too, as my cat refuses to relieve himself unless he can squat on $$$ premium litter. So I have a huge bag of that cheap litter, might as well use it up.

With the big blizzard that just rolled through Winnipeg, I was able to play in the snow with my new Dunlop Graspic DS-2 winter tires. They are GREAT in deep snow!

I found a truck stop on the Perimeter bypass that hadn't been plowed yet, and the gusty winds of 40-50 MPH really whipped up some drifts. I tried driving into some one foot drifts - ready to back out if I bogged down.

With the proper tires, the car will EASILY pull itself through 12 inches of snow, even with the ice underneath. I stopped to get out and the door pushed the snow away. The front bumper was pushing the snow too.

Only if I really floored it did the Trac kick in, but I was able to easily power through the snow. So the proper winter tires really do make a difference.

Note: just like my 1992 Honda Prelude, the Prius will collect snow at the front of the rad and also between the rad and motor. This could freeze the electric cooling fans and cause problems. I have heated underground parking, so everything will melt by tomorrow morning.

 

Yes, the kitty litter is good to get moving. The manufacturers of the stuff hat I listed claim that it may help for few miles.

I just got similar stuff at PepBoys today, $3 a spray can. We'll see if it helps when the ice comes back to Illinois

 

Pepa: depending on how much Lake Effect you get in your part of Illinois, the traction aid may help a bit or a lot. You won't go wrong with four proper snow tires.

I went to my hobby farm this weekend and even with the freezing rain, ice, snow, and nasty drifting snow, no problems. I feel much more confident in winter with my Dunlop Graspic DS-2 tires.

I only had one truly scary moment: I tried to pass a slow moving semi on the Trans Canada. I had pulled up almost even with the trailer bumper and a HUGE gust of wind (Recorded gusts of 50-60 MPH this weekend) pushed the trailer over towards me.

I put both feet on the brake pedal and the Prius stopped almost as fast as on bare pavement. The trailer didn't jackknife but came very close to doing so. Once the trucker straightened out I quickly went past him.

The RCMP should have closed that stretch of the Trans Canada. The icy road surface, combined with the very strong side gusts, made it very dangerous for high profile vehicles.

 

jayman,

I'm little reluctant to buy snow tires, we're on the "left" side of the lake so it's not as bad as the Michigan side. That's why I was looking for something more-less temporary, just to make it up hill to my garage/house.

Should I live in Winnipeg where summer starts Tuesday and ends on Friday I'd certainly get my snow tires right now

 

In Winnipeg, summer begins Monday and ends Tuesday ... s***, I missed it!

I suppose if you only occasionally have to worry about snow/ice, it wouldn't be too much fun to put up with snow tires. The steering response is quite numb, and they wear quickly, especially in temps over 50 F.

 

well, if we can defeat the trip map thingie, maybe there's a way to TEMPORARILY defeat the system that prevents the car from going up slick hills?

Evan, i can't wait to see the disclaimer on THAT puppy!......

ps....
when i had the console off to install the trip computer defeat switch, i did notice that the little black (literally) box sitting on top of what looked like a parking brake cable assembly said something like "Yaw Control Module" on it!!!!!!!! guess where the next override switch will connect?!

and, the appropriate disclaimer: i am not suggesting that anyone try this, and if you do, it's your decision, and your tush on the line. don't even think of blaming me for something you decided on your own to try! (end of disclaimer).

 

A friend of mine has a 2002 Buick Century, and it has a disable button at the end of the column shifter. You can poke it to temporarily disable the traction control, which he needs to do when going up some very steep hills to his property.

With winter tires on his Century, he needs a bit of wheelspin to dig down to get going again. It would be unsafe to race up that steep hill, you might head-on into an oncoming car at the crest.

My parents have a 2003 Buick LeSabre Celebration Edition and it also has the disable button at the end of the column shifter. As far as I know, my folks have never had to disable the traction control.

BTW: I can now strongly recommend the Cooper WeatherMaster ST-2 studded tires. My folks had an older set of Firestone WinterFire studded tires, but they were getting worn. I drove their LeSabre to the tire shop today and had 4 studded WeatherMaster tires put on.

Thanks to the freezing rain from last weekend, many parts of Winnipeg are treacherous. Those Cooper studded tires are amazing, you have to put the pedal right to the mat to get the traction control to kick in.

The noise isn't too bad, but the LeSabre is a very quiet car anyway. With the driver window down, you sure can hear the "pitter-patter" of studs on dry cement.

 

Heh heh heh... Yeah, I've never been there, but I was few times to International Falls in winter - I can't imagine the winter you must put up with up there, another 200+ km north! Brrr!

What mileage are you getting on average, and what is it during winter moths?

 

HA! We call International Falls "down south!"

When the temps were around -25 C, according to the MFD I was averaging 6.8 l / 100 km (41.5 MPG cdn gallon) in city driving, and on the Trans Canada at 105 km/h, I was getting 5.7 l / 100 km (50 MPG cdn gallon).

A coworker with a mid-nineties Chevy Corsica V6 reports around 16 MPG city driving, and her car is kept in very good tune. So I'm sure not complaining about my lower winter fuel economy.

I think it also really helps that my condo has heated underground parking, and at work I park in heated underground parking.