Hybrid specific oil: Do we need it?

Discussion in 'Prime Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Marine Ray, Dec 9, 2019.

  1. Marine Ray

    Marine Ray Senior Member

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    "Our advice: There’s no need to yield to dealerships or service shops suggesting that you should follow a dramatically tighter service schedule because you have a hybrid. Stick to the intervals recommended in your owner’s manual, and a formulation like this is probably a good pre-emptive measure."

    Valvoline released a hybrid-specific motor oil: Do you need it?
     
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  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    marketing 101, toyota oem, mobil 1, or etc
     
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  3. Marine Ray

    Marine Ray Senior Member

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    Pennzoil website says their hybrid oil only 0W-16. So that's for the 2020 Prius Prime only. 2017-19 Prius Primes use 0W-20.
     
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  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    I really doubt there's any difference between 2020 model year engines and previous. Apart from the piston/ring revision, I think the 3rd/4th gen engines are identical. There are obvious differences in the bolt-ons too, the oil filter bracket, the EGR system, intake and exhaust manifolds. But the internals of the engine, the same?

    Accordingly, I wouln't say that one model year engine "needs" 0W20, and another 0W16. It's more just that Toyota's policy has changed.

    The Prius 3rd/4th gen 1.8 liter engine is also used, essentially the same, in non-hybrid Corollas.
     
  5. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    IIRC, Gen2 Prius PHV (model ZVW52, aka PRIME in the US) in Japanese market always had factory suggested 0W-16 oil. The reason US version (and maybe other regions?) had 0W-20 was due to availability issue, not because of any mechanical differences. Now, 0W-16 oil are starting to show up on a shelf of many auto stores including Walmart in the US, Toyota must have changed the recommendation. I am thinking to use 0W-16 oil for the next oil change on my 2017 PRIME.

    Prius PHV oil.png
     
    #5 Salamander_King, Dec 9, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2019
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  6. Marine Ray

    Marine Ray Senior Member

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    Does 0W16 provide any better fuel economy?
     
  7. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Probably marginally better fuel economy but, more important to Toyota, likely increased engine wear too so it will need to be replaced sooner. The engine only needs to last long enough to satisfy government regulators.
     
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  8. MTN

    MTN Member

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    Right. /sarcasm

    Just like 0w20, and 5w30, and ... before. All the "car guys" said "That stuffs water" and your engine will be smoking and breaking down in no time.
    Change the oil when and with what the manual spec's and the chance of having an oil-related problem are very, very low over the lifespan of the vehicle. Design issues are much more likely to present a problem - e.g. Hondas/Mazda with fuel dilution issues. Subarus and headgasekts, etc.
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    they'd be recommending water now, if it raised mpg's and got most engines past warranty
     
  10. The Big Sleaze

    The Big Sleaze Junior Member

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    I'm thinking depends on your local temps. If you live in warmer temps then use the heavier oil since it will still flow at startup and warmup, if in colder region use thinner to get more flow when cold/cool.
     
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  11. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    The products with the least actual differentiation get the most advertising. See flashlight batteries & motor oil for examples.
     
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  12. Marine Ray

    Marine Ray Senior Member

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    Does insurance qualify? Most insurance is the same cost. Most insurance ads are iconic or have some sort of catchy mascot (AFLAC geese, GEICO gecko, PROGRESSIVE)
     
  13. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    Oh absolutely. High margin, no difference from one to the next... yep they'll pour piles of it into the ad budget.
     
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  14. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Until you need to make a claim. In my experience, service from insurance companies varies widely.
     
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  15. Dennis G Waller

    Dennis G Waller New Member

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    Mendel: Can you provide a reference for the changed "piston/ring revision" on the 2020 Prius Prime? Dennis Waller
     
  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    2010 to partway through 2014 used pistons:
    13101-37120
    And rings:
    13011-37110

    Remainder of 2014 and 2015 used pistons:
    13101-37240
    And rings:
    13011-37260

    2016 onward used pistons:
    13101-37250
    And rings:
    13011-37270

    As far as I know, those last two part numbers are still what's used, for 2020 Prius and Prius Prime. You can verify by checking the various years, searching for "piston" and "piston rings", on an online Toyota parts retailer. McGeorge Toyota Parts is one.

    The object, with the first change was to reduce oil consumption. From what I've read the piston ring outward "spring" was increased, and the oil drain channels improved.

    I would guess the second revision, with the advent of 4th gen, was just a further refinement.
     
  17. Vman455

    Vman455 Active Member

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    The first number tells you what viscosity grade the oil conforms to at low temperatures--so in a warm climate you could get away with a higher "xW-". But regardless of outside temperature, your engine operates at the same temperature well above ambient, around 90-100C, where the second number denotes the viscosity grade (at 100C). So why would you want to move to an xW-30 from an xW-20 if the operating temperature hasn't changed? If xW-20 was fine in freezing weather, it's fine in Death Valley in summer.
     
  18. Old Bear

    Old Bear Senior Member

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    I generally try to avoid discussions related to motor oil because they tend toward the theological.

    However, one consideration is how oil viscosity varies with temperature. The synthetic oils tend to remain fairly constant over the wide range of temperatures from sub-zero winter starts to cruising across Death Valley in summer. There are some graphs of viscosity vs temperature available on several of the manufacturers' web sites.

    Another issue is the tolerance between moving parts such as rings and cylinders -- which also change with temperature because different metals expand a different rates. I am sure that there are mechanical engineers who can discuss this in much greater detail. It is a subtlety well beyond my limited expertise.

    Personally, I just follow the recommendations in the owner's manual. I have enough other issues to obsess about. ;)
     
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