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NEED HELP DECIDING IMMEDIATELY: Two exact same 2010 Prius IV with diff price

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by Beethovenite, Nov 14, 2012.

  1. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    I'm going into a dealer to check out two certified pre-owned 2010 Prius IV tomorrow morning. The dealer I'm going to has two similar vehicles, but the prices are quite different. I need some opinions and advice as I am a first time car buyer. I'd like to find out why the price is much lower on one of them.

    Car No. 1:
    2010 Prius IV Model
    $22,400
    36,400 miles
    Black Exterior w/ Gray Leather Interior
    Premium Accessory Package

    Car No. 2:
    2010 Prius IV Model
    $24,000
    36,150 miles
    Black Exterior w/ Gray Leather Interior

    I looked at their carfax and there seems to be a STAGGERING difference:

    [​IMG]

    So the cheaper car has NO history of maintenance, service, oil change, etc. Does this mean that the car has had absolutely NO maintenance over the last couple of years? I was told that some people take their cars to mechanics that don't report to carfax, is this true? I'd like to find out if this is something I should be worried about because at this moment, I am definitely leaning on purchasing car #1. But if car #1 is going to prove to be a headache going into the future with breakdowns, I am not going to bite the bullet. I don't know much about cars, but some of my friends have informed me that cars that never get maintenance/oil change usually means the car is going to have a LOT of problems and will not work well in the future.

    I would be grateful if anyone out there would share their expert opinion on buying used Hybrids. Both of them are CERTIFIED PRE-OWNED Prius from the same Toyota dealer--this makes me hope that there is nothing wrong with car #1...

    Just to clarify, I got them to give me 1.9% APR financing on top of $1000 off final price on either of the cars. This is before I even walked into the dealer, where I plan on negotiating some more.
     
  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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  3. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    GOOD CALL, cwerdna.

    I just did what you suggested and this came up on Car #1 (the cheaper car with no history of maintenance):
    [​IMG]

    So it looks like there were some electrical issues with this car. What about oil change? Aren't you supposed to do that every 5000 miles? This car's had only one or two oil change in its ENTIRE life time. Is this a bad news for me? Should I avoid this car? I would love some advice... many thanks!
     
  4. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    IMHO, both have identical warranty and if the equipment is the same, go with the non-smoker car. If there is no history of a major repair or insurance claim, again, go with the nicer car. I wouldn't read much into the price unless they are at the same dealer. Then ask the obvious question.

    Now if one of them has lane following and collision avoidance, I would buy it in a hear beat. Over the life the car, you are less likely to be involved in an accident and you'll find adaptive cruise control great on cross-country trips. But that is me.

    After you decide, please share technical details of the two cars and the offered price of the other one.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  5. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I don't know what's up with "electrical concern". I take it the above is from the cheaper one w/o oil changes listed on Carfax?

    Oil change interval on Gen 3 Prius became 10K miles w/required synthetic. I had to LOL about the "world class inspection". Those words have only come up a few times. Google for
    Code:
    site:priuschat.com "world class inspection"
    .
     
  6. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    Thanks for your thoughts, Bob. As stated, both cars are indeed from the SAME dealer. And as you can see in my second post, there were ELECTRICAL issues that had to be addressed more than once within short period of time. I am beginning to think car #1 is a lemon. What are your thoughts on this?

    Could you please elaborate on what the "lane following and collision avoidance" is? I have never had a car before and I am complete newbie. Thank you for your help.
     
  7. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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  8. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    Amazing! I just looked up both IKA and PCS. I am really impressed. Both would come in really handy, especially considering I do go on long trips to go camping. But now I am really concerned about this electrical issue, because I googled 2010 Prius electrical issues and I am finding rather a lot of complaints... could this car be a lemon? Anyone know much about the electrical issues on the 2010 Prius?
     
  9. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    The Prius, including the 2010 has a very good reliability record w/every single model year in Consumer Reports (they only have 03-11 listed) having much better than average reliability. Electrical doesn't look like a problem spot in CR. It still has a very good rating in that system.

    Without knowing more details of these unspecified "electrical concerns", I have no idea. For all we know it was user error or the original owner ran their 12 volt flat or their dealer did it for them (like this one: Closed Minds | PriusChat). On a Prius, if the 12 volt is low, you will NEVER get symptoms of slow cranking or starter unable to turnover the engine as the Prius has no dedicated starter motor. The engine isn't started by the 12 volt either. Instead, usually weird stuff happens or the car won't start up.
     
  10. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    Wow... that is some scary stuff. Why would the tech people do this...

    I'm sorry, but, what is "CR"? So you don't think that I should try to avoid the car #1?

    I will def test drive both and see how it feels. I will probably feel a difference considering that car #2 has had a TON of maintenance service... too expensive for me, though...
     
  11. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Sorry, CR = Consumer Reports.

    If price is a concern, do look into a less well equipped model, possibly a new one. Or, if its size and err.... cheaper interior is ok w/you, do consider the The Toyota Prius c models and prices. I wouldn't buy the model One due to lack of cruise control.
     
  12. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    I am pretty set on buying a Prius III. The only reason why I considered IV was because I got the salesperson to knock off about $2000 worth from the final price. I guess the only thing left to figure out is if this electrical issue along with bad maintenance record is something I should be concerned about. Like I said, I've never owned a car before and I don't know if that's something to be concerned about. Would YOU buy car #1?
     
  13. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    You mean a Gen 3 (2010+) regular Prius aka the liftback? For 2010, the models were I thru V. For '11 and beyond, they went to spelling out the words (One thru Five) instead of Roman numerals.

    I'd probably steer clear of car #1 w/o knowing more about the supposed electrical problem.

    For MY 12, there were some significant changes to the trim levels (Exclusive: 2012 MY Prius - Changes and Additions | PriusChat is mostly right except there's no backup camera on model Two). 2012 Toyota Prius MPG | Prius Prices shows MSRPs.
     
  14. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    Yah, I've found myself 2010 Prius III for a decent price already. I'm gonna go see what I can do to lower some more and if I can find a good price, I'll take it. Around $350 for 60 months with no down payment is good for me. I'm willing to do that.

    Thanks for all your help. Looks like I will probably avoid car #1 after talking to them tomorrow...
     
  15. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Let's start over with an introduction to the Prius. Unlike traditional cars, this is a computer operated car. As a driver/owner, we tell the computers what we want and the computers handle the details:
    • engine control computer - handles valves, throttle, mixture, and the electric water pump. This has all but eliminated the mess of hoses and belts found under the hoods of a traditional car.
    • hybrid vehicle controller - handles gear 'shifting', power and interface to the electronic brake.
    • electronic brake - with the hybrid vehicle controller handles regenerative and emergency braking. This includes a 'hill hold' assist so when stopped on a slope at a traffic light, you can take your foot of the brake and accelerate without rolling back into the car behind.
    • electronic steering - this alone eliminates the major, hydraulic pump and tubing using an electric motor to assist steering at slow speeds.
    • traction battery computer - this handles keeping the traction battery state of charge and within optimum operating ranges so they will last incredibly long . . . as long as every other part.
    • body control computer - handles lights, door locks, wipers(?), e.t.c.
    • air bag controller - deals with accidents
    • keyless security - keeps the bad guys from easily driving off with the car
    Now the first Prius dates from 1997 and has gone through multiple generations:
    • NHW10 - first Prius only in Japan, 1.5L engine, computer controlled, compact sedan
    • NHW11 - first Prius in North America, the NHW10 with more power but same compact sedan body
    • NHW20 - second Prius in North America, same engine but more power and larger, hatchback body
    • ZVW30 - third Prius in North America with 1.8L engine and more power, larger, body
    What these computer controlled, electrical cars do is replace heavy, inefficient mechanical assemblies with efficient, reliable electrical systems. Software now tweaks the car performance AND can be updated. For example, there was an obscure, brake pause that was difficult to replicate. About the time we found out how to replicate it, Toyota issued a field upgrade that downloaded new brake controller software that all but eliminated the pause.

    Now if you are used to working on mechanical cars, the Prius could be a challenge. But it you are comfortable with cell-phones, iPads, computers, and digital movies, the Prius will be just another, terribly useful appliance . . . one that will take you from point A to point B and consistently get +50 MPG. Each tank can deliver over a 500 mile range with a bunch of 'stuff' in the back. For example, I put a tow bar on mine for an oversized load:
    [​IMG]

    That was a long drink of water for a short swallow. You'll get a warranty with either car so I would not worry about an 'electrical' problem. Talk with the sale-critter and they may have some sort of extended warranty BUT I would have no interest. You would be better served to take a vocational-tech electronics course so 'electrical' won't be intimidating. It isn't that hard to do.

    GOOD LUCK!
    Bob Wilson
     
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  16. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    Bob, thanks for your UBER post. Very enlightening and yes, I am VERY comfortable with technology. I'm the kind of guy that will sit in the car and spend 2 hours and learn about every button AND USE THEM. The reason why I am concerned is that I have never had a car before, so I am getting a lot of warnings from people I know. Electrical issues I would imagine is a BIG deal considering that, as you say, Prius is a computer-run machine. If you think this is not a big deal since I'll have the 12-month comprehensive warranty, I will seriously consider car #1.

    Here's the issue I face outside of the electrical issues: TERRIBLE CAR MAINTENANCE. I've looked up on carfax AND registered this vehicle as my own on the Toyota owner's website to see its service history. This car #1, which I am VERY interested in, has had ONE maintenance in its life time and had TWO electrical issue-related visits within a very short period of one another. This concerns me because it seems as though the driver of the car did not take a good care of the car. I would imagine that people who don't take good maintenance care also drive terribly without much care for the car. It might be like buying a car that was a rental car at a rental company--a big no no for me. So as you can imagine, red flags are going up all over inside my brain at this moment.

    I will of course test drive car #1 and ask multitude of questions at the dealer, but who really knows what they will say? Salespeople are salespeople, after all. Thanks again for your brilliant insight and please let me know what you think about my concerns. I've posted images of all the maintenance/service record on car #1 on this thread. Thank you again.
     
  17. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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  18. Beethovenite

    Beethovenite Junior Member

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    I see. Good to know. I wasn't sure if a third party oil change would show up on car fax or not. I will be sure to ask about this tomorrow. I've learned so much about cars and car buying in the last 24 hours... I feel like a NEW man! Thanks for all your help. :)
     
  19. Les_PL

    Les_PL Active Member

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    Is that OK as I read in manual that towing by Prius is not recommended?
    Very nice summary above anyway :)
     
  20. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    ^^^
    Correct, recommended tow capacity of Prius is 0 lbs. I've never towed anything w/mine but that doesn't stop others... :whistle: