Prius Battery Replacement (GenII) Like you've never seen - NEW Cylindrical Cells

Thankyou for trying to say what I am trying to say in another way.

On the warranty, that's exactly what it is. There are lots of companies that are offering a warranty and I seriously doubt you will ever collect on it. I see claims on eBay all the time for cells with 1 year or 6 month "warranties" and then you read the stories here how every claim is denied because it was installation error, or the seller just gets up and leaves, or makes a new user account, etc. That's shady. I've invested the better part of a decade on PriusChat and other Prius related mediums so it would be really inconvenient for ME to disappear! lol

I say no warranty, have never said otherwise. I have the intention of offering a goodwill style replacement for any early failures, but I want to be clear this isn't a warranty or a promise to offer one. It is like all the other things I sell on eBay, Amazon, etc. If it breaks and it seems accidental or a manufacturing defect, I will replace it, usually ship it out free too. Again no promise to do this, no warranty expressed or implied now or in the future. And one person's hypothetical goodwill replacement does not mean a pattern.

I'd be interested to see what everyday items he uses that aren't from China! Even most Japanese and Korean companies are doing the actual manufacturing in China. Not to mention almost every US company making there stuff in China. China has top of the line manufacturing and test capabilities just because they do so much they can afford to spend on the highest end equipment and easily make it back up. My local assembly shop has an x-ray machine for BGA (Ball Grid Array) components from the late 1980's. My Chinese PCB assembler has an MRI style machine that does a full 3D image with thin skin slices like a high end brain scan. They can tell exactly how the ball has compressed onto the pad and if/where any cracks are. The x-ray just gives you a 2D top down black/white blob that you can tell by the size of blob if it is compressed enough...

Anyways, here is a small sample of qualifications for the electrified automotive market from about 6 years ago. It is not hard to figure out what company this is, but again obfuscation because I am not in the business of taking credit for everything. No NDA here, but a fun project. Most of the BMS system, instrumentation system, charge system, and even the system that turned the blinkers on and off was done by yours truly. Note the red 2006 Prius on the left with the non-stock wheels... That whole truck is electric, no gas engine.

 

At production volumes, you can get NiMH for about $550/KWh. Prius is 14*14.4*6.5*550/1000 = $720 of NiMH cells. That would be approximately what Toyota pays for only the cells inside a pack. Thanks in large part to Tesla, A123, and even cell phone companies, Lithium packs as long ago as the end of last year were being priced at around $180/KWh to $270KWh. There is a large variation in chemistry and architecture.

As of today, not only is Lithium denser, meaning more juice for the same footprint or a smaller footprint for the same juice, but it quickly becoming the cheapest option. Everything is lithium today. There was a study showing that about 96% or 97% (going off of memory) of all hybrids/electrics sold by major auto manufacturers were Lithium recently and in the next wave of MY changes, it will be nearly 100%.

NiMH is dead for cars. But there are a few millions of these cars on the road and the pack will eventually die. The packs will likely become more expensive over time as the used market for packs dries up due to age and the only source being new packs that the auto-makers do not want to make. Why make a $2K pack for a car that's worth $2K in value? They do now because they are forced to by warranty laws. I do not believe it will financial sense to do so in the future. Just like I can't find any parts for my DeLorean except for some New Old Stock from the early 1980's when it was made and aftermarket things. And when you do want a new part, the price is 10x or more what it was or should be, and everytime one gets sold you know it since the price of all the remaining ones jumps.

 

You are welcome to not purchase if you don't want it. I think I have been rather clear that this is currently a hobbiest DIY solution and have called would-be first adopters guinea pigs multiple times. Also welcome to develop your own kit and give your time away for free, and I won't rain on your parade for doing so. I have mailed out about 18 of my CAN to USB adapters that I designed and produced here on PriusChat as a weird side project long ago with a little OLED screen. Never intended to sell them, got some PMs, mailed them out for free. I intend to sell this. Different story.

The Toyota pack has a warranty and the backing of Toyota for slightly more ONLY if you do installation yourself and return your old pack for the $1.3k core charge. If you buy $2k worth of kit and new cells my way, you end up with 28 extra stock cells, 26-27 of which should be very usable. Sell them on eBay for about $700 after fees, and now you have a $1.3k kit with brand new cells and no warranty. I am being very upfront about this and the onus is on the seller to get rid of their own cells. I seem to sell a few original Toyota modules online every day, easy money to just post for sale and let the cash roll in to get rid of used but functional cells.

 

Yes the KOH is a very strong base and usually looks like a white chaulky powder when it accumulates around the terminals. However the part underneath begins to corrode and that's what you see. The white powder is the KOH, the remaining stuff is the evidence that it was there. Along with a few warning triangles over the years about a "HV Isolation Leak" that have gone away after replacing the pack...

"Battery Acid" is used mostly in lead acid batteries (surprise!) however I am not trying to be super technical. You start getting the deer in headlights look when you say anything that starts sounding "chemistry like". But "battery acid", people are aware is "goo that leaks out of a battery" and that's what I've got. I doubt many people remember the differences between their bases and acids let alone the chemical makeup of a battery.

Same reason why I just smile and say "not quite" when someone concludes that I as an electrical engineer with a focus in power level semiconductors does the same job as the guy that puts lightswitches in houses. Explaining the existence of a semiconductor is actually a very difficult process to people who have little knowledge in the field let alone the minutia that separate them. Also why my basic electric engineering debug advise is "if you see the smoke and let the magic genie out of the part, it probably won't work anymore".