Snow Tires, Rims & TPMS Question

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-Current)' started by NEHiker, Aug 10, 2018.

  1. NEHiker

    NEHiker New Member

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    Hi everyone -- I've been reading through all the various posts regarding snow tires, rims & TPMS on the forums here. Although winter is a ways off, I've been starting to contemplate getting snow tires mounted on their own rims. I don't live in a state where TPMS has to be operational to pass inspection, but I'm not sure I will be able to find a tire shop to do a snow swap with a set of tires/rims that doesn't include a set of TPMS sensors. I'm not keen on paying the dealer or tire place an exorbitant TPMS reprogramming fee every time I do a snow swap.

    With that said, I started reading the posts related to the Autel and ATEQ TPMS tools. Could someone help me sort out the following scenario? Let's say I buy a set of snow tires and rims with their own TPMS sensors. It looks like I need an Autel or ATEQ tool that will do the following:

    (1) Read the sensor codes from the existing summer tire TPMS sensors that are on the factory wheels.
    (2) Read the sensor codes on the winter tire TPMS sensors.
    (3) ? Connect to the car's ECU via the OBD II port to reprogram the car, so it knows about the winter tire sensors? (and vice versa for the summer tire sensors after the spring tire swap).

    #3 is where things get unclear for me. Several of the TPMS tools look like they only will do #1 and #2 above. Thanks in advance!
     
  2. ForestBeekeeper

    ForestBeekeeper Active Member

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    I have four winter-only studded tires with out TMPS, and I have four summer-only tires with TMPS.

    This setup seems to work great for us.
     
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  3. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Having two household cars with TPMS, I finally bought the ATEQ Quickset and VT30 tools some years ago, not inexpensive then. The former works fine, the later was fine at first, but seems quirky now. But the later is needed only to read the ID of unknown new sensors. Once IDs are known, the Quickset is sufficient. I don't know anything about more recent or competing tool models.

    Quickset will read the IDs out from the car's ECU. But do this first, before anything overwrites them.

    Have the tire shop give you the codes of your new sensors (should be included in the packaging), then enter them via computer into the Quickset -- after reading out and recording the factory ID numbers from the car.

    Or, if the tire shops puts the new wheels and sensors on the car once, they will program the new IDs into the car as part of the service. Then use the Quickset to read them back out.

    If you buy tires/wheels/sensors online and they are delivered without the codes, then you need the VT30 to read the IDs through the sidewall, or pay a tire shop to do it all. Just once, then use the Quickset to extract the new IDs from the car.

    ATEQ Quickset does #3, programmed from your computer USB port, after you have somehow learned the IDs at step #2. Other competing tools should work similarly. Though the tire shops have costlier handheld tools that do it all, quickly, without connecting to any other computer.
     
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  4. WilDavis

    WilDavis Senior Member

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    My birthday being in June, means that here in NH the inspection is due in June, and during the summer my 2009 Gen II is wearing its summer wheels (16" OEM alloy rims (with TPMS) plus summer tyres). Come snow-season, the car will be wearing a set of 15" steel-rims shod with Bridgestone Blizzak WS-80s (no TPMS) - however I found these things on amazon and have them on the wheels all year round, and transfer them from summers to winters as necessary!

     
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  5. PT Guy

    PT Guy Senior Member

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    Check about the reprogramming. Our Prime is my second set of TPMS wheels, and once installed I swap the wheels without any problems. No reprogramming. The first car was a Kia with Kia sensors. The second is the Prime with aftermarket sensors from Discount Tire on the winter wheels. It's just bolt & go when I swap the summer wheels and the winter wheels.

    Yes, I like TPMS. It has found punctures in time to save the tires. I've destroyed a tire in the past, a rear on a FWD Volvo, where I did not know the tire was low until the rim hit the pavement (and I consider myself to be an aware driver). My '16 Mazda has a TPMS system that uses the ABS speed sensors on each wheel to compare wheel rpms to find a low (decreased diameter) tire. Not as accurate as a pressure sensor, and I don't think they're used on the newest models. In any case, I'll take either system. Driving on a low tire doesn't offer the best traction, leads to destruction of the tire and possibly a wreck, and wastes gasoline.
     
    #5 PT Guy, Aug 11, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
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  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    You've cleared the first hurdle, go for the second. Phone around, find out what tire shops say. Maybe if you show up with loose rims they will be more amenable to installing regular valves?

    TPMS on the Prius is a pain: the sensors are a big added expense, and the Toyota software requires (costly) reintroduction every time the wheels are swapped. Just avoid it if at all possible.

    FWIW, these are the rims I used, got them for $70 apiece:

    Corolla steel rim, part no: 42611-02471 (2003-2008 corolla or matrix, CE, LS, S)
    steel rim lug nuts, part no: 90942-01007 (plain, open-ended, galvanized)

    Kind of funky, but a 2" ABS end cap (black plastic) has an ID that just about fits the hub. It's slightly loose, with some sort of rubber band (say cut from bicycle inner tube pushed on first it stays secure.
     
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  7. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    And if you are willing to seasonally jack up the car and swap the wheel/tire sets yourself, then most tire shops should be agreeable to mounting tires onto loose rims with non-TPMS valves for you. They continue to do non-TPMS installations for legacy cars, which will still be around for a very long time, along with a variety of other vehicles not covered by TPMS requirements. When they are not the ones bolting the wheel onto the hubs, then they are generally released from the regulations governing working TPMS systems on customers' cars. And as owner-driver, you have more latitude than does the tire shop.
     
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  8. Mark McIntyre

    Mark McIntyre Junior Member

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    I am happy with my decision to buy winter tires, wheels, and TPMS from Discount Tire. I load them up in the vehicle, drive to Discount and they take care of the rest - twice a year with the change over cost and any TPMS issues included in the cost of the setup. Easy - Peasy.
     
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  9. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Just FYI, Mazda vehicles will recognize new tpms sensors. Maybe it's time Toyota smartened up...

    upload_2018-8-11_19-20-48.png
    upload_2018-8-11_19-21-20.png
     
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  10. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    I understand most American-branded cars to have been using this sort of system for a long time. The Asian brands have been lagging, not leading on this topic.
     
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  11. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    I have posted my problem using Autel MX programmable sensors.
    I bought a set of American Racing wheels and tires from TireRack.com.
    I bought the tool to program the new sensors and it also reads the old ones.

    Gabe's Hacks: How to clone and program new TPMS sensors with Autel MX Sensors & MaxiTPMS PAD

    It did what it was suppose to do and my plan was to clone the new sensors with the same ID
    as my original sensors but for some reason it wouldn't work and I got a TPMS warning light.
    I bought one of those cheap Chinese versions of Techstream and it showed my original sensors but was missing the part to register another set of sensors. I bought a second version of Techstream and could never get it loaded on my computer.

    Autel sells a tool that will program mew Autel sensors, read the old ones and plugs into the OBDII II plug to register it to the car for about $400.

    www.amazon.com/Autel-TS601-MaxiTPMS-TPMS-Professional/dp/B00BF23HVQ/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1534042559&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=autel+maxitpms+ts601&psc=1
     
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  12. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Having read a thread describing that European version of Gen4 has 8 TPMS slot in ECU How To Register TPMS IDs | PriusChat
    This means you can register 2 sets of TPMS for summer and winter and once both sets are registered properly to the ECU via Techstream or other TPMS OBDII device, you are able to switch the TPMS sets with just taps of buttons in the car. This raised hope for my new PRIME, but as it turned out, this feature does not exist in US version. I have no idea why.

    For US Prius owners, if you want to change two sets of tires and working TPMS, you either have to have dealer or tire shop to have new TPMS ID re-program or use Quickset or other TPMS handheld tools to do it DIY, or purchase cloneable TPMS and copy existing TPMS IDs. The cost after purchasing new rims and TPMS (anywhere from $400 ~ over $1000) for either twice a year to have someone swap the tire and re-program TPMS or invest in a tools and device to DIY is not trivial. It can be at least $300 to could be thousand $ for the life of car. In the end, for my previous cars, I decided the least expensive way, and purchased just tires from a local tire shop that include free winter change over and used the same rims and TPMS. The cost of tires and initial installation are all I needed to pay to have a set of snow tires. If I really wanted to have different set of rims and separate set of TPMS, I could have purchased them from the same shop and have them swap and re-program free too. If you are not doing the tire swap yourself, talking to local tire shop to find out what kind of after care services they will include if you buy set of tires (and maybe rims and TPMS) may save you a lot.
     
    #12 Salamander_King, Aug 12, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2018
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  13. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    How did you do this on PRIME? I read the thread describing that European version of Gen4 has 8 TPMS slot in ECU How To Register TPMS IDs | PriusChat but this seems not to apply to US version. Are you saying your PRIME is able to register 2 sets (8 TPMS) and switching between two sets are automatic without any procedure?
     
  14. PT Guy

    PT Guy Senior Member

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    It just works. Maybe Discount Tire uses the sensors that can be cloned to match the OE sensors?
     
  15. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Oh, so you take your car to have winter change over twice a year at Discount Tire? Must be the same set up as post #8 by @Mark McIntyre. Could be cloned TPMS or they use TPMS tool. How much do they charge for winter change over?
     
  16. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    I only went to Discount Tire once to get the TPMS light on my 1999 Plymouth Prowler turned out and the guy said they couldn't do it. He didn't say why. I had new tires that I bought from Discount Tire on line but they didn't put them on the rims and all new sensors on the car.
     
  17. PT Guy

    PT Guy Senior Member

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    I change the tires myself. It's quicker for me to do it than to take it to a store. It's also a good time to look at the brakes and anything else in that vicinity.
     
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  18. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    ... especially if one waits until, or gets caught with, the season's first foul weather in the immediate forecast. That causes major waiting lines at all the tire stores, making for a huge time savings by being able to do one's own tire/wheel swap at home.

    But I'll second the statement that home swaps are faster even without such forecast-driven waiting queues.
     
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  19. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    I am sorry for dwelling on this, but I am just puzzled as to how you have accomplished seemingly without much effort the feat every Prius owners in snow belt are struggling to accomplish. If I summerize your statements, you have purchased a set of winter tires and aftermarket TPMS (and maybe wheels) from Discount Tire and had them install. Ever since, you have two sets of tires AND TPMS on separate wheels, and twice a year you perform change-over DIY at home. You do not use any type of TPMS reprogramming tools nor take your car to dealer or shop to have TPMS re-programed, but magically your Prius recognizes swapped set of TPMS in different wheels as soon as you start the car. Since we know US version of Prius do not recognize more than 4 TPMS IDs, this means Discount Tire must have copied the existing OEM TPMS IDs onto aftermarket TPMS just like @padroo have tried DIY using Autel cloneable TPMS, as quoted
    Does this sound correct?
     
    #19 Salamander_King, Aug 15, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2018
  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Maybe he doesn't have tpms sensors? That's my situation, very simple.

    I appreciate that takes your car off the road in certain US States.
     
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