Traction Battery, from beginning to end

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by DoIt, Nov 21, 2021.

  1. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    OK, here is the beginning. Got the red triangle and red car with !, and other lights. Autozone scan says loose gas cap, hehe. Traction battery charge indicator rapidly changing blue to green and back. Error reset, by disconnecting 12 V cleared lights for about 10 mi. 140K miles and am original owner, am pretty sure the traction battery is fried.

    Where to start? Mini VCI/tech stream, multimeter, just replace the whole thing.... I understand that mini VCI and multimeter tests will find the problem cell(s), however, replacing bad cells may cause balance issues and assume that other cells may soon fail.

    Am thinking to start with visual inspection and multimeter voltage test of cells without battery removal, if that's possible. Assuming I find the bad cell(s), the next decision will be on replacing cells or the whole pack. Am also considering just ordering a rebuilt or replacement pack and just skipping straight to the end. Also, my daughter continues to drive short commutes, not sure this is good thing. Comments/suggestions?
     
  2. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    You haven't given us a trouble code yet. "Autozone scan says loose gas cap" doesn't help much, because it seems like they told you what somebody thought a code meant, and didn't tell you the code.

    Whether Techstream or any other usable scan tool, getting the trouble code(s) would be the first order of business. Until then, you're jumping the gun even to think the traction battery is at issue.
     
  3. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Primary codes at autozone were P0441 and C1241. The 12V battery checked out OK. These codes have been with me a long time resulting in check engine light.

    Am getting Panglong OBD2 to use with Dr. Prius app, "
     
  4. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    So, what you're saying is that they described the P0441 EECS Incorrect Purge Flow as potentially being a gas cap issue, but failed to mention it could also be about a hundred other things causing it. Assuming the code was correctly read.

    C1241 is a battery positive low OR high voltage. This is a brake system code. There are a few more potential causes than just the 12v battery being good or bad. Could be something as simple as one of the ABS relays malfunctioning.

    If you had hybrid battery codes, that scanner didn't show them. If you didn't have hybrid battery codes, then you're about to chase your tail. Actually, until you get a confident, accurate code reading, you will probably end up chasing.
     
    #4 TMR-JWAP, Nov 21, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2021
  5. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Understood, I'll be posting the Dr. Prius scan results, hopefully in a few days. Was tempted to just replace pack with that $1600 pack and skip to the end, but I would be missing out on all the fun.
     
  6. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Typo in initial post, should read 240K miles. Got Dr Prius battery readout, attached. I see #5 block with lower voltage and higher resistance. I also see low resistance on blocks 6 and 10. I understand that there are 2 modules, 6 cells each, per block. Therefore, I believe I have at least 1 failed module in block 5 and the low resistance in blocks 6 and 10 may well be the result of two more failed modules.

    Am considering purchasing 3 modules now. My thinking is that I may do the voltage and resistance tests on the 6 modules in blocks 5, 6, and 10, rather than testing all 28. Replace the bad modules and balance. Am also considering purchasing rebuilt for a little less than 600 or finding one at a junk yard. Thoughts?
     

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  7. alftoy

    alftoy Active Member

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  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

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    Just looking at that Dr Prius screenshot: is it possible that low voltage on one module is caused by the higher resistance, and just opening the pack and cleaning all the posts and busbars will cure it, bring the voltage back up?

    I'm likely just blowing smoke, but thought I'd ask... :unsure:
     
  9. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Thanks, hopefully that is all it is. Looking to minimize down time as I'm continuing to drive. To remove battery, clean the posts and busbars, and replace, may result in similar down time? If I have it out and apart that far, I would feel obligated to at least check those 3 modules. If I have replacement modules on hand, then I would avoid being down for at least another 3 days to receive replacement modules. Thinking that if it turns out that I don't need them, or all of them, I may return or sell them. See them for 21 on ebay. Another concern I have is skipping testing and reconditioning all 28 modules...
     
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  10. nancytheprius

    nancytheprius Member

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    I am assuming it is the original hybrid battery? If so, chances are modules are truly failing. I would not skip the testing and/or reconditioning if replacing modules is the route you're going
     
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  11. nancytheprius

    nancytheprius Member

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    Just saw this message and is crucial as well!
     
  12. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Yes, original battery with 240K mi. The scanner not finding codes was the initial autozone scan, which i believe is irrelevant upon Dr. Prius scan. Was hoping that the Dr. Prius scan may save equipment costs (charger/discharger) and/or hours for reconditioning all 28 modules.
     
  13. 2010moneypit?

    2010moneypit? Junior Member

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    Depending on the warranty I would just skip to get a whole rebuilt pack.

    I thing to consider when replacing cells is that the pack needs to be balanced After replacing suspected bad cells.
     
  14. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Appreciate the advice. The new pack is 1600 and this is an 05 with 250K mi, not sure that makes economic sense. My plan now is to order 1 module for $21, pull battery, check voltage on each mod., replace the low volt mod in block 5. Flip every other mod and run a wire down each side to balance and soak the copper contacts on bus bars in vinegar. Wait about 20hrs and put back together and put back in car. Anyone care to hedge bets on a percentage of success? I give myself a 75% prob of success. If the red triangle does pop back up, then I'll buy the rc carger/discharger and recondition all 28.
     
  15. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    I guess 10-15% chance of success (ie putting it together and having no fault codes for at least six months).

    If you read all the module replacement threads and get enough chargers to cycle all module 3-6 times and measure capacity- I'll give you 75%.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  16. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    You can forget this, it is not balancing it is equalizing. Although it won't do anything bad (or good) except just waste your time.

    You mentioned blocks (2 modules per block) 6, and 10 'looked low too', but they look fine to me so I'd leave them be.

    How well this works really depends on how your replacement module matches the other 27 modules as far as capacity and how well you recondition the replacement module, as mr_guy_mann said.
     
  17. Albert Barbuto

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    If you have deep pockets, and limited time, replace the entire pack. Otherwise, replace any bad modules. You may get up to a year of service before needing to do this all over again. See link below:

    NEW Battery from dealer | PriusChat

    If you would like your module replacement to last as long as possible, the entire hybrid pack needs to be cycled, with any replacement modules installed. It is easiest, and fastest, if you do all modules in one go, via a "Prolong" style charge/discharge method. A minimum of 3 to 5 cycles would be the ticket.

    Better yet, but insanely time consuming, is to cycle each module individually. As per mr guy mann's above post.
     
  18. Another

    Another Active Member

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    If you’re looking for something to do, and have the time, I’d do as you are doing and spend the time rather than money. Worst case if it fails you’ll just have to go Plan B and change the entire battery. Hopefully you have a warm and dry place to do the work in.
     
  19. DoIt

    DoIt Junior Member

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    Thanks for the input / advice. Looked at those prolong grid chargers, bit pricey. Looking at alternatives here and see where an HLG-80H-C350A, about $50 delivered, can be used to charge and an incandescent bulb can be used to discharge. Since I'll have the pack out for cleaning of bus bars and replacement of module, I'll cycle while out and blow a floor fan over the pack. Looks like I should plan a week to complete the cycles.
     
  20. Albert Barbuto

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